From: taylanbayirli@gmail.com (Taylan Ulrich Bayırlı/Kammer)
To: David Kastrup <dak@gnu.org>
Cc: "Ludovic Courtès" <ludo@gnu.org>, "Eli Zaretskii" <eliz@gnu.org>,
emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: Re: Emacs rewrite in a maintainable language
Date: Sat, 17 Oct 2015 20:34:15 +0200 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <87pp0duyxk.fsf@T420.taylan> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <87d1wdpf1c.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> (David Kastrup's message of "Sat, 17 Oct 2015 19:42:55 +0200")
David Kastrup <dak@gnu.org> writes:
> taylanbayirli@gmail.com (Taylan Ulrich "Bayırlı/Kammer") writes:
>
>> David Kastrup <dak@gnu.org> writes:
>>
>>> taylanbayirli@gmail.com (Taylan Ulrich "Bayırlı/Kammer") writes:
>>>
>>>> I haven't followed the whole discussion but I'd like to remind that
>>>> GuileEmacs already runs currently, and from what I know none of the
>>>> problems it faces are related to string handling. It just lets Elisp
>>>> strings be a separate data type.
>>>>
>>>> I guess the discussion was about rewriting bigger parts of Emacs in
>>>> Guile-Scheme, which might be one possible way to go forward but not
>>>> necessary.
>>>>
>>>> Most of the benefits in e.g. http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/GuileEmacs
>>>> apply without having to solve the string problem. Specifically, from
>>>> the overview section, the first two points and half of the third should
>>>> apply I think.
>>>
>>> The first two points concern efficiency. Emacs is _all_ about working
>>> with strings, and the last report of GuileEmacs stated something like
>>> GuileEmacs being about an order of magnitude slower specifically because
>>> of having to special-case Emacs strings and buffers.
>>>
>>> Emacs is first and foremost an editor. Substantial increases of
>>> efficiency in most general programming areas at the cost of abysmal
>>> performance in text processing are not going to make the race.
>>
>> I think you're misremembering.
>
> So performance is comparable?
Regarding Elisp string munging, probably, since the same C code as
before applies.
>> It might be that you have strings in mind because not being able to
>> serialize Elisp strings means having to compile everything at each
>> startup, making startup slow. And maybe you have buffers in mind
>> because buffer-local variables and other weird binding semantics of
>> Elisp need special handling.
>>
>> Neither is related to the run-time performance of string handling, of
>> course.
>>
>> Hmm, what would be a good benchmark of Elisp string handling that
>> won't be affected by the performance of dynamic binding of variables
>> or other such things? I'd like to just test it instead of
>> hypothesize.
>
> Most relevant candidates are likely file load/save, string display and
> stuff like regexp searches through buffers.
Opening a 30 MB IRC log file takes the same amount of felt time as on
upstream Emacs. Saving it too.
(while (re-search-forward "taylan" nil t) (ignore)) in the same file is
pretty much instant on both.
I think there's simply no speed difference in string munging on
GuileEmacs so far. It really just uses the existing C "subrs".
Taylan
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2015-10-17 18:34 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 250+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2015-10-11 8:11 Emacs rewrite in a maintainable language Przemysław Wojnowski
2015-10-11 8:17 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-11 22:02 ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-10-11 22:14 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-11 22:37 ` Óscar Fuentes
2015-10-11 22:37 ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-10-11 22:49 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-11 22:51 ` Óscar Fuentes
2015-10-11 23:12 ` Drew Adams
2015-10-12 2:43 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-12 15:35 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-12 21:30 ` Daniel Colascione
2015-10-12 20:01 ` Richard Stallman
2015-10-11 8:54 ` Alexis
2015-10-11 10:53 ` Przemysław Wojnowski
2015-10-11 11:23 ` Thomas Koch
2015-10-11 13:11 ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-10-11 13:36 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-11 13:39 ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-10-11 13:55 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-11 14:03 ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-10-11 12:52 ` Daniel Colascione
2015-10-11 12:59 ` Fabrice Popineau
2015-10-11 17:25 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-11 18:32 ` Óscar Fuentes
2015-10-11 19:14 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-11 19:43 ` Óscar Fuentes
2015-10-11 19:53 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-11 20:13 ` Óscar Fuentes
2015-10-12 2:33 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-12 3:59 ` Paul Eggert
2015-10-12 8:12 ` Steinar Bang
2015-10-12 9:36 ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-10-12 10:20 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-12 12:23 ` Óscar Fuentes
2015-10-12 16:08 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-12 20:00 ` Richard Stallman
2015-10-13 2:36 ` Rustom Mody
2015-10-12 10:56 ` Michael Heerdegen
2015-10-11 21:52 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-12 7:14 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-12 12:48 ` Oleh Krehel
2015-10-12 13:22 ` Óscar Fuentes
2015-10-12 14:18 ` Oleh Krehel
2015-10-12 15:04 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-12 18:24 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-12 19:21 ` Óscar Fuentes
2015-10-12 19:39 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-12 19:46 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-12 19:58 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-12 20:11 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-12 20:42 ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-10-12 20:46 ` Óscar Fuentes
2015-10-13 14:57 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-13 16:22 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-13 16:40 ` Drew Adams
2015-10-13 16:49 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-12 20:40 ` Drew Adams
2015-10-13 4:18 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-13 6:00 ` immerrr again
2015-10-13 14:59 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-13 1:12 ` Óscar Fuentes
2015-10-13 10:01 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-13 15:12 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-13 15:20 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-14 15:04 ` Chris Patti
2015-10-14 15:34 ` Jay Belanger
2015-10-16 12:25 ` Guile-Emacs Ludovic Courtès
2015-10-16 12:03 ` Emacs rewrite in a maintainable language Ludovic Courtès
2015-10-16 13:30 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-16 14:55 ` Wolfgang Jenkner
2015-10-16 15:14 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-16 15:25 ` Ludovic Courtès
2015-10-16 15:51 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-16 14:29 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-16 15:08 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-16 15:28 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-16 16:05 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-16 15:31 ` Ludovic Courtès
2015-10-16 16:11 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-16 19:34 ` Przemysław Wojnowski
2015-10-16 19:51 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-16 19:52 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-16 20:51 ` Ludovic Courtès
2015-10-17 5:27 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-17 7:20 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-17 9:44 ` Ludovic Courtès
2015-10-17 10:24 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-18 10:22 ` Ludovic Courtès
2015-10-18 11:33 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-18 12:54 ` Taylan Ulrich Bayırlı/Kammer
2015-10-18 13:17 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-18 14:40 ` Taylan Ulrich Bayırlı/Kammer
2015-10-18 15:31 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-18 16:19 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-18 16:37 ` Taylan Ulrich Bayırlı/Kammer
2015-10-18 16:44 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-18 17:06 ` Taylan Ulrich Bayırlı/Kammer
2015-10-18 17:11 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-18 17:36 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-18 17:52 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-18 18:23 ` Daniel Colascione
2015-10-18 18:35 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-18 18:53 ` Daniel Colascione
2015-10-18 19:03 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-18 19:13 ` Paul Eggert
2015-10-18 19:35 ` Taylan Ulrich Bayırlı/Kammer
2015-10-18 19:49 ` Daniel Colascione
2015-10-19 7:59 ` Taylan Ulrich Bayırlı/Kammer
2015-10-19 10:50 ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2015-10-19 10:59 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-19 11:31 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-19 12:04 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-19 11:24 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-20 4:18 ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2015-10-20 7:36 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-20 10:17 ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2015-10-19 12:26 ` Taylan Ulrich Bayırlı/Kammer
2015-10-19 12:53 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-19 17:43 ` Tom Tromey
2015-10-19 18:06 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-20 2:46 ` Tom Tromey
2015-10-19 8:46 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-19 9:39 ` Przemysław Wojnowski
2015-10-19 5:33 ` Richard Stallman
2015-10-26 11:01 ` Alexis
2015-10-18 19:16 ` Taylan Ulrich Bayırlı/Kammer
2015-10-18 22:38 ` Nicolas Petton
2015-10-20 7:34 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-18 16:40 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-18 16:56 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-18 17:46 ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2015-10-19 7:45 ` Gian Uberto Lauri
2015-10-17 15:38 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-17 16:25 ` Taylan Ulrich Bayırlı/Kammer
2015-10-17 16:43 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-17 17:00 ` Taylan Ulrich Bayırlı/Kammer
2015-10-17 16:48 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-17 17:03 ` Taylan Ulrich Bayırlı/Kammer
2015-10-17 17:08 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-17 17:10 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-17 18:31 ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2015-10-17 17:04 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-17 17:32 ` Taylan Ulrich Bayırlı/Kammer
2015-10-17 17:42 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-17 18:34 ` Taylan Ulrich Bayırlı/Kammer [this message]
2015-10-17 19:15 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-17 21:22 ` Taylan Ulrich Bayırlı/Kammer
2015-10-18 0:23 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-18 15:53 ` Richard Stallman
2015-10-18 16:58 ` Tom Tromey
2015-10-18 17:40 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-18 19:40 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-18 20:47 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-19 3:55 ` Tom Tromey
2015-10-20 7:33 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-12 19:43 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-13 8:27 ` Przemysław Wojnowski
2015-10-13 8:52 ` Gian Uberto Lauri
2015-10-13 10:19 ` Tassilo Horn
2015-10-13 15:14 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-13 19:45 ` Tassilo Horn
2015-10-13 15:05 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-13 16:09 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-13 20:43 ` Przemysław Wojnowski
2015-10-13 16:06 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-13 20:20 ` Przemysław Wojnowski
2015-10-13 21:22 ` emacs IDE features (was: Emacs rewrite in a maintainable language) Andrés Ramírez
2015-10-13 22:13 ` emacs IDE features John Wiegley
2015-10-14 11:11 ` Phillip Lord
2015-10-16 23:13 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-17 7:40 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-17 23:51 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-18 0:48 ` Sacha Chua
2015-10-18 2:34 ` Xue Fuqiao
2015-10-18 17:05 ` Sacha Chua
2015-10-18 17:31 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-18 16:21 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-19 16:37 ` Christopher Allan Webber
2015-10-18 16:47 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-18 17:30 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-19 10:30 ` Phillip Lord
2015-10-20 6:56 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-13 22:10 ` Emacs rewrite in a maintainable language John Wiegley
2015-10-12 23:00 ` Camm Maguire
2015-10-13 1:38 ` Alexis
2015-10-13 1:40 ` Daniel Colascione
2015-10-13 23:34 ` Richard Stallman
2015-10-13 23:55 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-13 5:28 ` Ken Raeburn
2015-10-13 5:39 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-13 10:13 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-14 1:43 ` Daniel Colascione
2015-10-13 6:49 ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2015-10-12 13:50 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-12 15:17 ` Oleh Krehel
2015-10-12 15:35 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-12 16:29 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-12 22:39 ` Paul Eggert
2015-10-13 11:27 ` Oleh Krehel
2015-10-13 11:46 ` Alan Mackenzie
2015-10-13 12:02 ` Oleh Krehel
2015-10-13 12:21 ` Alan Mackenzie
2015-10-13 12:22 ` Mathieu Lirzin
2015-10-13 13:52 ` John Yates
2015-10-13 14:30 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-13 16:26 ` Andreas Schwab
2015-10-13 16:40 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-13 14:38 ` Oleh Krehel
2015-10-13 13:06 ` Sergey Organov
2015-10-13 14:19 ` Artur Malabarba
2015-10-13 14:39 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-13 15:21 ` Artur Malabarba
2015-10-13 15:53 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-13 16:09 ` Oleh Krehel
2015-10-13 16:23 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-13 16:31 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-13 16:38 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-13 15:21 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-13 15:42 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-13 15:32 ` Paul Eggert
2015-10-13 16:13 ` Oleh Krehel
2015-10-13 21:02 ` Andy Moreton
2015-10-14 8:15 ` Oleh Krehel
2015-10-14 13:28 ` Andy Moreton
2015-10-14 16:18 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-14 10:22 ` Przemysław Wojnowski
2015-10-14 10:56 ` Tassilo Horn
2015-10-14 11:14 ` Przemysław Wojnowski
2015-10-14 11:33 ` Oleh Krehel
2015-10-14 12:12 ` Tassilo Horn
2015-10-14 11:46 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-14 12:29 ` Tassilo Horn
2015-10-14 11:21 ` Mathieu Lirzin
2015-10-14 16:05 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-13 16:13 ` John Wiegley
2015-10-12 15:09 ` Paul Eggert
2015-10-12 15:24 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-12 15:24 ` Oleh Krehel
2015-10-12 16:31 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-12 17:20 ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2015-10-13 12:02 ` Marcus Harnisch
2015-10-13 23:38 ` Richard Stallman
2015-10-14 1:46 ` Daniel Colascione
2015-10-14 13:08 ` Marcus Harnisch
2015-10-12 16:18 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-12 17:47 ` Steinar Bang
2015-10-12 17:59 ` David Kastrup
2015-10-12 21:28 ` Daniel Colascione
2015-10-11 18:36 ` Przemysław Wojnowski
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