From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: =?utf-8?Q?=C3=93scar_Fuentes?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs learning curve Date: Tue, 13 Jul 2010 01:53:53 +0200 Message-ID: <87ocecdzou.fsf@telefonica.net> References: <4C3B6A8A.80105@gmx.de> <87wrt0e81n.fsf@telefonica.net> <62E9699C07054418AB66F9C5FCB54E5C@us.oracle.com> <87sk3oe3la.fsf@telefonica.net> <1154D96E7D2F401D849266F359E44BB9@us.oracle.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1278978855 4536 80.91.229.12 (12 Jul 2010 23:54:15 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 12 Jul 2010 23:54:15 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Jul 13 01:54:13 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OYSpB-0004Cr-2t for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 13 Jul 2010 01:54:13 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:35170 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OYSpA-0003GM-JG for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 12 Jul 2010 19:54:12 -0400 Original-Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=59534 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OYSp3-0003Dk-Jm for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 12 Jul 2010 19:54:06 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OYSp2-0005Lx-97 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 12 Jul 2010 19:54:05 -0400 Original-Received: from lo.gmane.org ([80.91.229.12]:41045) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OYSp2-0005Lp-2i for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 12 Jul 2010 19:54:04 -0400 Original-Received: from list by lo.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OYSoz-00049k-Mh for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 13 Jul 2010 01:54:01 +0200 Original-Received: from 83.42.13.171 ([83.42.13.171]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Tue, 13 Jul 2010 01:54:01 +0200 Original-Received: from ofv by 83.42.13.171 with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Tue, 13 Jul 2010 01:54:01 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-Lines: 26 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: 83.42.13.171 User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:1J9La64Ey6ypq4oLwae/Mu13c0U= X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:127130 Archived-At: "Drew Adams" writes: >> BTW, the red/green issue is more real than you seem to think. Have you >> developed a GUI (or any sort of visual interface) that uses colors for >> communicating critical info? A color-blind subject could argue that >> you are being perverse when using red and green for displaying info, >> no matter you refer to them by the "right" names on the manual. > > Sigh. I was afraid of this. You are probably not truly missing the > point (I hope), but you are certainly acting as if you were. Mauvaise > foi, it must be. No, I'm not missing the point at all. Whoever chose the terms split-window-horizontally and split-window-vertically did a suboptimal job, because they mean different things to different people, and using ambiguous terms or expressions must be avoided. The fact that this sub-topic arised is proof of the problematic nature of those terms. And usage of down/up on Emacs (as for scrolling) contradicts current stablished practice. Yes, there is a reasoning for doing what Emacs does, but the issue is that it is contrary to the expectations of almost anybody who learned to use computers on the last 20 years. Terms must convey meaning to users, not confuse them. [snip]