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From: Robert Thorpe <rt@robertthorpeconsulting.com>
To: Emanuel Berg <embe8573@student.uu.se>
Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org
Subject: Re: Real-life examples of lexical binding in Emacs Lisp
Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2015 23:07:33 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <87oakedm56.fsf@robertthorpeconsulting.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <871thaulbv.fsf@debian.uxu> (message from Emanuel Berg on Wed, 17 Jun 2015 22:33:08 +0200)

Emanuel Berg <embe8573@student.uu.se> writes:
> I take it "lexical" refers to you can make it out by
> looking at the code.

Yes.

> "Dynamic" refers to it depends on the code and the
> program state in execution.

Yes.

> I agree those terms are confusing. To me, it sounds
> like they refer to call-by-value vs.
> call-by-reference, which isn't so.
>
> I'd call it "normal scope" vs.
> "stacked scope", perhaps.

Both cases are usually implemented using stacks.  Thinking about this
helps understanding.

In the lexical scope case we can think of one huge stack.  Each entry in
the stack can contain many elements.  When execution enters a "let" form
a new entry is created on the stack and the variables declared there are
stored in that entry.  They "shadow" other variables with the same name
- they take precedence over them.  When execution exits the let form
that stack entry is deleted.  This is usually how lexical scope is
implement too.

For dynamic scope we can think of each variable name as being associated
with it's own stack.  When execution reaches a let form a new value is
pushed onto the stack for the relevant name.  When the let form exits
it's deleted from the top of the stack.  Code always uses the
top-of-stack value, so earlier let forms are shadowed by later ones.
This is one way of implementing dynamic scope too, it's "shallow
binding".  I think it's how Elisp implements it.

Dynamic scope was an accident of how Lisp was first written.  See:
http://www-formal.stanford.edu/jmc/history/lisp/node4.html

The question of "extent" rather than "scope" brings up more problems.
So does "deep" vs "shallow" binding with dynamic scope.

BR,
Robert Thorpe



  reply	other threads:[~2015-06-17 22:07 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 50+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2015-05-29  8:28 Real-life examples of lexical binding in Emacs Lisp Marcin Borkowski
2015-05-30  8:28 ` Tassilo Horn
2015-06-14 10:52   ` Marcin Borkowski
     [not found]   ` <mailman.4976.1434279182.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-06-14 11:31     ` Pascal J. Bourguignon
2015-06-16 23:48       ` Jim Diamond
2015-06-17  0:06         ` Emanuel Berg
2015-06-17  6:23           ` Andreas Röhler
     [not found]           ` <mailman.5136.1434522217.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-06-17 10:49             ` Pascal J. Bourguignon
2015-06-17 10:53               ` Pascal J. Bourguignon
2015-06-17 14:42                 ` Stefan Monnier
2015-06-17 16:19                   ` Andreas Röhler
2015-06-17 19:30                     ` Tassilo Horn
     [not found]                   ` <mailman.5171.1434557990.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-06-17 17:12                     ` Stefan Monnier
2015-06-17 20:22                   ` Emanuel Berg
2015-06-17 22:13                     ` Pascal J. Bourguignon
2015-06-17 23:46                       ` Emanuel Berg
2015-06-18 14:57                     ` Udyant Wig
2015-06-18 15:47                       ` Emanuel Berg
2015-06-19 13:49                         ` Udyant Wig
2015-06-19 17:41                           ` acronymania (was: Re: Real-life examples of lexical binding in Emacs Lisp) Emanuel Berg
2015-06-19 17:53                             ` Rusi
2015-06-17 20:33             ` Real-life examples of lexical binding in Emacs Lisp Emanuel Berg
2015-06-17 22:07               ` Robert Thorpe [this message]
2015-06-17 22:17                 ` Pascal J. Bourguignon
2015-06-17  0:43         ` Pascal J. Bourguignon
2015-06-17 16:02         ` Phillip Lord
     [not found]         ` <mailman.5167.1434556959.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-06-23 23:49           ` Jim Diamond
     [not found] ` <mailman.3950.1432974543.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-05-30 12:59   ` Pascal J. Bourguignon
2015-06-14 10:55     ` Marcin Borkowski
     [not found]     ` <mailman.4977.1434279342.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-06-14 20:04       ` Stefan Monnier
2015-06-14 21:44         ` Pascal J. Bourguignon
2015-06-14 21:49           ` Pascal J. Bourguignon
     [not found] <mailman.3883.1432888152.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-05-29  9:30 ` Joost Kremers
2015-05-29 11:12   ` Andreas Röhler
2015-05-29 12:13     ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-05-29 16:21     ` Phillip Lord
2015-05-29 16:50       ` Yuri Khan
2015-05-29 12:28 ` Pascal J. Bourguignon
2015-05-29 17:16   ` Andreas Röhler
2015-05-29 18:43 ` Emanuel Berg
2015-05-30  5:49 ` Rusi
2015-05-30 12:50   ` Pascal J. Bourguignon
2015-05-30 15:23     ` Rusi
2015-05-30 15:50       ` Pascal J. Bourguignon
2015-05-30 16:21         ` Rusi
2015-05-30 16:03   ` Emanuel Berg
2015-05-30 16:32     ` Rusi
2015-05-30 16:54       ` Pascal J. Bourguignon
2015-05-30 17:10         ` Rusi
2015-05-30 19:12           ` Pascal J. Bourguignon

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