From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: =?utf-8?Q?=C3=93scar_Fuentes?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs learning curve Date: Wed, 14 Jul 2010 01:06:07 +0200 Message-ID: <87lj9fc78g.fsf@telefonica.net> References: <4C3B6A8A.80105@gmx.de> <87wrt0e81n.fsf@telefonica.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1279062391 14845 80.91.229.12 (13 Jul 2010 23:06:31 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 13 Jul 2010 23:06:31 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Jul 14 01:06:30 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OYoYX-0008CW-VO for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 14 Jul 2010 01:06:30 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:59388 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OYoYX-0008AM-FG for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 13 Jul 2010 19:06:29 -0400 Original-Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=33398 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OYoYQ-000883-Qk for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 13 Jul 2010 19:06:23 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OYoYP-0007d4-72 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 13 Jul 2010 19:06:22 -0400 Original-Received: from lo.gmane.org ([80.91.229.12]:36124) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OYoYO-0007co-NI for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 13 Jul 2010 19:06:21 -0400 Original-Received: from list by lo.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OYoYM-000892-RB for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 14 Jul 2010 01:06:18 +0200 Original-Received: from 83.42.13.171 ([83.42.13.171]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Wed, 14 Jul 2010 01:06:18 +0200 Original-Received: from ofv by 83.42.13.171 with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Wed, 14 Jul 2010 01:06:18 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-Lines: 40 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: 83.42.13.171 User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:eWq/9ieyoSEmtRe3flN/rox376g= X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:127228 Archived-At: Miles Bader writes: > Óscar Fuentes writes: >> A few weeks ago I was required to translate an old, small Visual Basic >> application to C#. I was less than thrilled with the job, but anyways >> the first thing was to configure Emacs as a C# editor. > ... >> I gave up >> and tried certain popular IDE, out of despair. 15 minutes later my >> client's application, on its basic inception, was running on the screen, >> mostly thanks to an accurate and fast code completion system that not > > MS has spent vast amounts of resources pushing C# and .net as hard as > they can. It's not surprising that VS has very good C# support. For the code completion, I don't think that a huge effort is necessary. The most difficult part is to obtain the semantic info, which MS does with the compiler and Emacs can do likewise with CEDET/Semantic (or with a Free C# compiler.) Once you have that, you need the means for displaying the suggested completions and the associated documentation on a convenient way. Emacs already supports tooltips for the documentation, and a floating listbox doesn't seem too hard to do. This is for the code completion. I dunno about the real-time syntax checking, the project manager, debugger, refactoring... The most difficult part is to do it so it produces the Wow! reaction on the user. His first reaction must be "that's what I want to use." > But C# is a minor niche language in the sort of environments where Emacs > is most popular. Given relatively limited resources for Emacs > development, and the unpopularity of C#, it's hardly surprising that > Emacs C# support is less good.... C#, VB, F# are niche languages on the Unix world. But think about Java. Actually, think about any statically-typed language, or a dynamic one writing code at the same time the application is running. Once you work with one of those smart IDEs (count the Free Eclipse and SharpDevelop IDEs among them) you get addicted to those features and will consider as inferior choices any editor that lacks them.