From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Bastien Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs as word processor Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2013 08:28:42 +0100 Message-ID: <87k3f1uwnp.fsf@bzg.ath.cx> References: <5288A59E.7030109@dancol.org> <87vbzqfgd6.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <87mwl04w3k.fsf@zigzag.favinet> <87iovo4caz.fsf@zigzag.favinet> <878uvmoypl.fsf@dod.no> <871u1by9xz.fsf@Rainer.invalid> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1387438177 1841 80.91.229.3 (19 Dec 2013 07:29:37 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2013 07:29:37 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Achim Gratz , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Richard Stallman Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Dec 19 08:29:40 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1VtY39-0006oR-Us for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 19 Dec 2013 08:29:40 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:42588 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VtY39-0000XH-Ib for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 19 Dec 2013 02:29:39 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:51107) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VtY2P-0007lW-No for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 19 Dec 2013 02:28:59 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VtY2J-0002G2-68 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 19 Dec 2013 02:28:53 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-we0-x233.google.com ([2a00:1450:400c:c03::233]:60654) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VtY2I-0002Fe-Ur; Thu, 19 Dec 2013 02:28:47 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-we0-f179.google.com with SMTP id q59so651029wes.38 for ; Wed, 18 Dec 2013 23:28:45 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=sender:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:references:user-agent:date :message-id:mime-version:content-type; bh=/uRSuhdJ37bVh3xk2rBgZjLJ8Q7cogv4zs5ZKqHY7+Y=; b=0yc5HlFHE6Q2cx8FiI8aYgO0h3VSjsJSOhacbNdCkiB32Z6G9fm5vItKtT6lWbeLGV AlBfWYEf1O9WUuO1IRFE1PDzDeN0L94ctpKFKtmasNMmGHMlhzOsFFip6M8dtheLWZoZ sSbcR0/N/fK+VqqOIe2jlIWRK0vHfCmtsBffPl5r8DN0d1CLX0NHClLwZnWrPuFEEGWZ IEF5S2eHCEZkuLVmqW+rr14eQ9RAQM5DTX339AF45q6mhJt8ygsVPFfjTufD7RAlbTOk +s3ky9GABiux5YH5NRkselfrIhEaFH2AQsVBBXVtqfXClBOjlcpZjVpcr5ehQaldeJq5 Sdgg== X-Received: by 10.180.19.195 with SMTP id h3mr733692wie.11.1387438125694; Wed, 18 Dec 2013 23:28:45 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: from bzg.localdomain (mar75-2-81-56-68-112.fbx.proxad.net. [81.56.68.112]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id cx3sm9832099wib.0.2013.12.18.23.28.43 for (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 18 Dec 2013 23:28:44 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: by bzg.localdomain (Postfix, from userid 1000) id C5DAA1C205CE; Thu, 19 Dec 2013 08:28:42 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: (Richard Stallman's message of "Tue, 17 Dec 2013 16:06:41 -0500") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.3.50 (gnu/linux) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2a00:1450:400c:c03::233 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:166609 Archived-At: Richard Stallman writes: > For outlines, the default might be appropriate. > It follows that Org mode, as such, is not right for documents such as this. As Achim explained, a document like this one is displayed with all its parts completely visible: ======================================================================== #+STARTUP: showeverything * A section Some text. ======================================================================== > Telling the users, "Customize Org mode yourself" is unhelpful. This is not about customizing Org mode. This is about specifying *within* your document whether it should be read as a text or as an outline. Org mode is primarily used as a tool to manage lists of tasks, with notes possibly attached to the tasks. In this case, displaying the document as an outline is useful. Org mode is also used as a tool to write documents. If this is your use case and if you don't want people to see the document as an outline, inserting #+STARTUP: showeverything at the beginning of it is the way to go. > But it needs minor changes to be good for this purpose. I guess users would find the default folding behavior more useful than a default "showeverything" behavior -- but I might be wrong. If you have other ideas on how to improve Org mode, please share. Thanks! -- Bastien