From: phillip.lord@russet.org.uk (Phillip Lord)
To: Robert Cochran <robert-emacs@cochranmail.com>
Cc: "Clément Pit--Claudel" <clement.pit@gmail.com>, emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: Re: Development suggestions from an ENSIME developer
Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2016 21:14:03 +0100 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <87k2gcm7sk.fsf@russet.org.uk> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <87oa5pnvam.fsf@cochranmail.com> (Robert Cochran's message of "Fri, 22 Jul 2016 15:48:49 -0700")
I wasn't going to comment on this point, but I felt that your email
merited a response.
Robert Cochran <robert-emacs@cochranmail.com> writes:
> Clément Pit--Claudel <clement.pit@gmail.com> writes:
>
>> I for one would welcome a code of conduct :) These things tend to send
>> an explicit positive message, and there are virtually no downsides to
>> having one.
>
> I disagree.
This is one point that we agree with; CoC always remind me of the "Great
Loyality Crusade". In the end, these things can become a purpose in
themselves, as opposed their original intention.
> That tends to be an indicator that the SJWs have infected a project.
"infection" is a verb that we apply to disease. Personally, I find it
lacking in respect and rather worrisome to apply this to people what
ever we think of them. I feel the same about the use of "cancer" or "the
enemy within". I would ask that you do not do this.
You are welcome to describe this as political correctness; you'd even be
using the term correctly, which is a rarity these days.
> See http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=6918 for a larger picture. Let me leave
> you with this excerpt to set the stage (slightly adjusted to better fit
> ASCII):
>
>> Rosario tagged his Twitter report "Social Justice in action!" He knows
>> who these people are: SJWs, "Social Justice Warriors". And, unless you
>> have been living under a rock, so do you. These are the people – the
>> political and doctrinal tendency, united if in no other way by an
>> elaborate shared jargon and a seething hatred of djangoconcardiff’s
>> "white straight male", who recently hounded Nobel laureate Tim Hunt out
>> of his job with a /fraudulent/ accusation of sexist remarks.
While I am very respectful of Eric's many talents, in the case of Tim
Hunt he is entirely incorrect. I am a biologist as well as a software
developer, I'm familiar with Tim's work and, of course, a greatly admire
it.
When I heard his statements reported (and which he then justified on
national radio), I considered them to be silly, but then felt that,
hopefully, he would have learned his lesson, and then we should just
forgive and forget.
But, then I discussed the issue with many of my colleagues; turns out,
that they were less willing to forgive. Actually, many of there were
extremely angry. Like me, science is a part of their life, a vocation
not an occupation. But, they had just heard a senior scientist describe
them as not good enough, prone to tears when criticised, just because
they are women. I was wrong; it's not my place to forgive and forget,
it's theirs.
I think Tim wasn't hounded out of his job by "social justice warriors";
I think he left out of embarrassment when he realised how many of his
colleagues he had deeply offended.
> I know that I'm a relative newcomer to the Emacs lists, and that my
> opinion isn't going to be as highly esteemed as some, but this issue is
> important to me and I feel like I need to make my voice heard.
As another relative newcomer, welcome to the mailing list.
Phil
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2016-07-23 20:14 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 41+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2016-07-20 13:54 Development suggestions from an ENSIME developer Lars Ingebrigtsen
2016-07-20 14:02 ` Clément Pit--Claudel
2016-07-22 22:48 ` Robert Cochran
2016-07-23 7:30 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-07-23 9:00 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2016-07-23 19:52 ` Richard Stallman
2016-07-23 13:50 ` Clément Pit--Claudel
2016-07-23 20:14 ` Phillip Lord [this message]
2016-07-25 18:34 ` Robert Cochran
2016-08-03 6:05 ` John Wiegley
2016-08-06 18:42 ` Alex Dunn
2016-07-20 14:03 ` Dmitry Gutov
2016-07-20 14:08 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2016-07-20 14:12 ` Dmitry Gutov
2016-07-20 14:23 ` Christian Kruse
2016-07-20 14:41 ` Dmitry Gutov
2016-07-20 14:30 ` Christian Kruse
2016-07-20 14:44 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2016-07-20 15:02 ` Clément Pit--Claudel
2016-07-20 15:07 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2016-07-20 15:31 ` Clément Pit--Claudel
2016-07-20 17:00 ` Stefan Monnier
2016-07-21 18:40 ` Phillip Lord
2016-07-21 19:30 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-07-21 20:22 ` Stefan Monnier
2016-07-21 21:26 ` Christian Kruse
2016-07-21 22:04 ` Dmitry Gutov
2016-07-21 20:23 ` Phillip Lord
2016-07-21 20:50 ` joakim
2016-07-22 6:59 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-07-22 10:46 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2016-07-22 11:48 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2016-07-22 13:00 ` Robert Weiner
2016-07-22 13:34 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-07-22 14:28 ` Robert Weiner
2016-07-22 14:45 ` Ted Zlatanov
2016-07-22 13:35 ` Stefan Monnier
2016-07-22 14:38 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-07-22 14:56 ` Stefan Monnier
2016-07-22 15:58 ` Phillip Lord
2016-07-22 15:47 ` Phillip Lord
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