From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Stephen J. Turnbull" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Lawyer's evaluation Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2003 23:41:46 +0900 Organization: The XEmacs Project Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Message-ID: <87isniw8np.fsf@tleepslib.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> References: <871xud8z7j.fsf@tc-1-100.kawasaki.gol.ne.jp> <87vfro7uga.fsf@tleepslib.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <877k3yxxjx.fsf@tleepslib.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> NNTP-Posting-Host: deer.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1064414977 7036 80.91.224.253 (24 Sep 2003 14:49:37 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2003 14:49:37 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Wed Sep 24 16:49:34 2003 Return-path: Original-Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([80.91.224.244]) by deer.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1A2AxS-0005hp-00 for ; Wed, 24 Sep 2003 16:49:34 +0200 Original-Received: from monty-python.gnu.org ([199.232.76.173]) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1A2B4C-0004kL-00 for ; Wed, 24 Sep 2003 16:56:33 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1A2ArY-0007Zm-UC for emacs-devel@quimby.gnus.org; Wed, 24 Sep 2003 10:43:28 -0400 Original-Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.22) id 1A2ArF-0007YX-Gi for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 24 Sep 2003 10:43:09 -0400 Original-Received: from mail by monty-python.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.22) id 1A2ArD-0007Xn-DI for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 24 Sep 2003 10:43:08 -0400 Original-Received: from [130.158.98.109] (helo=tleepslib.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1A2Aq8-0007Md-VE for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 24 Sep 2003 10:42:01 -0400 Original-Received: from steve by tleepslib.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp with local (Exim 3.36 #1 (Debian)) id 1A2Apu-0002jV-00; Wed, 24 Sep 2003 23:41:46 +0900 Original-To: storm@cua.dk (Kim F. Storm) In-Reply-To: (Kim F. Storm's message of "24 Sep 2003 14:19:18 +0200") User-Agent: Gnus/5.1001 (Gnus v5.10.1) XEmacs/21.4 (Portable Code, linux) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2 Precedence: list List-Id: Emacs development discussions. List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:16602 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:16602 >>>>> "Kim" == Kim F Storm writes: Kim> So if I never distribute my changes, who really cares Kim> [whether I accepted the GPL or not]? Nobody, AFAIK ... but we should be careful. Kim> I bet that many people who have modified - and later Kim> contributed their valuable code to emacs and other GNU Kim> projects - never really read the GPL in all its fine detail Kim> (I think they understand the spirit of it though). I think they understand the spirit of cooperation; I much doubt they understand the "kiai" (unyielding martial spirit) of Copyleft. Copyleft is a double-edged sword; it can inhibit, as well as promote, cooperation. For example, the incompatibility of the GPL and the FDL is quite annoying in a language that supports docstrings. >> In fact, it implies acceptance of the license. That means we >> really need to say that such distribution must follow the terms >> of the license. I don't see how that can happen if the user >> doesn't read it. Kim> I'd guess it happens everyday :-) Kim> Some person wants to "give away" his software, and picks the Kim> GPL as the license to use; that doesn't mean that he actually Kim> read it first. He may just think: If GPL is good enough for Kim> GNU software, then it's certainly good enough for my software Kim> :-) This is not a problem. (Unless, of course, he applies the same logic to the FDL, thereby unwittingly creating problems for would-be forks.) However, if the software in question is derived from Emacs, and he doesn't understand the GPL, he's very likely to engage in the kind of "cherrypicking" David Kastrup warned against encouraging. Eg, failing to distribute source or a "written offer to supply source" with binaries to people "who don't want it". I've done that myself (in 1991, when I really had no clue about GPL; I believe that nobody was denied the chance to exercise GPL rights that he would have wanted to, but technically it was a violation). You see, me, ca. 1991, is who I was aiming the first draft for. -- Institute of Policy and Planning Sciences http://turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp University of Tsukuba Tennodai 1-1-1 Tsukuba 305-8573 JAPAN Ask not how you can "do" free software business; ask what your business can "do for" free software.