"text mode" org mode

"text mode" org mode

[Emanuel Berg via General discussions about Org-mode.]

Can I tell Org mode to don't change editing back and
forth, also don't collapse items in and out, i.e.
virtually text mode, only I still want the font lock
and to be able to use the mode to set keys, the
functions to compile into a PDF, and so forth.

TIA

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https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: "text mode" org mode

[Russell Adams]

On Tue, Sep 15, 2020 at 02:27:17PM +0200, Emanuel Berg via General discussions about Org-mode. wrote:
> Can I tell Org mode to don't change editing back and
> forth, also don't collapse items in and out, i.e.
> virtually text mode, only I still want the font lock
> and to be able to use the mode to set keys, the
> functions to compile into a PDF, and so forth.

I believe you can set your #+STARTUP on your file to "showall".

https://orgmode.org/manual/In_002dbuffer-Settings.html

This will make the whole file open. I don't know if you could disable
tab folding a drawer later though.

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Re: "text mode" org mode

[Emanuel Berg via General discussions about Org-mode.]

> Can I tell Org mode to don't change editing back
> and forth, also don't collapse items in and out,
> i.e. virtually text mode, only I still want the
> font lock and to be able to use the mode to set
> keys, the functions to compile into a PDF, and
> so forth.

Here is part of an IRC conversation that perhaps
clarifies what I mean... (the last sentence should
not be seen as a threat BTW :))

    <rogim> incal: that "Outliner" feature (i.e.
            collpasing and replacing things) is more
            or less the core of org-mode. emacs being
            emacs I bet you can disable it. but it
            would be completely braindead. in the
            true sense of the word. you would
            lobotmoize emacs.
            
    <incal> well, one can easily think of outliner
            features for HTML, CSS, LaTeX, even
            source code for every programming
            language, and I never used it for
            anything else
            
    <incal> so I guess I have always been braindead :)
            
    <rogim> I get what you mean, I don't use code
            folding like this anywhere else.
            it's just annoying with code.
            but org-mode is really about organzing
            information in a tree and collapsing
            parts of it and maybe moving things
            around. so if you don't need it, org-mode
            might be the wrong tool there. then again
            emacs can be adapt for everyone ofc
            
    <incal> what I was looking for was a way to
            typeset that had a less involved syntax
            than LaTeX, to be able to create simple
            PDFs, somewhere between plain text and
            LaTeX. I asked on gmane.emacs.orgmode ,
            if they cannot solve it I'll just
            `require' org, apply the org-mode's
            font-lock to a text-mode buffer, and use
            `org-latex-export-to-pdf'

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Re: "text mode" org mode

[Emanuel Berg via General discussions about Org-mode.]

Russell Adams wrote:

> I believe you can set your #+STARTUP on your file to "showall".

That's a good, uhm, start! Thanks.

> This will make the whole file open. I don't know if
> you could disable tab folding a drawer
> later though.

Well, I can rebind that key...

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Re: "text mode" org mode

[Emanuel Berg via General discussions about Org-mode.]

Russell Adams wrote:

> I believe you can set your #+STARTUP on your file
> to "showall".

Can I prevent hyperlinks from folding back and forth?

I mean, with [[][]] ?

Hm, maybe this will just go on and on if there is no
option to do it for real. The font-lock idea was
perhaps not so bad...?

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Re: "text mode" org mode

[Gustavo Barros]

Hi Emanuel,

On Tue, 15 Sep 2020 at 14:27, Emanuel Berg via "General discussions about Org-mode." <emacs-orgmode@gnu.org> wrote:

> Can I tell Org mode to don't change editing back and
> forth, also don't collapse items in and out, i.e.
> virtually text mode, only I still want the font lock
> and to be able to use the mode to set keys, the
> functions to compile into a PDF, and so forth.
>
> TIA

That's probably not something most Org users would do, but I think you'd
get close to what you want with:

    (add-hook 'org-mode-hook 'visible-mode)

HTH.

Best,
Gustavo.

Re: "text mode" org mode

[Russell Adams]

On Tue, Sep 15, 2020 at 03:16:56PM +0200, Emanuel Berg via General discussions about Org-mode. wrote:
>     <incal> what I was looking for was a way to
>             typeset that had a less involved syntax
>             than LaTeX, to be able to create simple
>             PDFs, somewhere between plain text and
>             LaTeX. I asked on gmane.emacs.orgmode ,
>             if they cannot solve it I'll just
>             `require' org, apply the org-mode's
>             font-lock to a text-mode buffer, and use
>             `org-latex-export-to-pdf'

Markdown, Asciidoc and Pandoc? There are many modern solutions to
exporting from text to pretty formats. Org just happens to have many
more features. If Org's core features (ie: outlining) are in your way,
perhaps one of those tools is more suitable?

Emacs has modes to fontify those formats too.

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Re: "text mode" org mode

[Stefan Nobis]

Emanuel Berg via "General discussions about Org-mode."
<emacs-orgmode@gnu.org> writes:

> Can I tell Org mode to don't change editing back and
> forth, also don't collapse items in and out, i.e.
> virtually text mode

I did not test it to every detail, but the following two settings may
be a good starting point:

#+begin_src elisp
(setq org-startup-folded 'showeverything)
(setq org-link-descriptive nil)
#+end_src

Also have a look at all the ~org-toggle-*~ commands like
~org-toggle-link-display~ and ~org-toggle-pretty-entities~ (the source
of these commands should reveal the associated variable that can be
set globally to the desired start value).

--
Until the next mail...,
Stefan.

Re: "text mode" org mode

[Diego Zamboni]

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Hi Emmanuel,

Nearly everything in org-mode is configurable, so I think what you want is
definitely doable.

In addition to using `visible-mode` as suggested by Gustavo (this is maybe
the easiest), you can also configure Org to show the emphasis markup
characters:

    (setq org-hide-emphasis-markers nil)

And to show the full markup of links:

    (setq org-link-descriptive nil)

--Diego


On Tue, Sep 15, 2020 at 3:35 PM Emanuel Berg via General discussions about
Org-mode. <emacs-orgmode@gnu.org> wrote:

> Russell Adams wrote:
>
> > I believe you can set your #+STARTUP on your file
> > to "showall".
>
> Can I prevent hyperlinks from folding back and forth?
>
> I mean, with [[][]] ?
>
> Hm, maybe this will just go on and on if there is no
> option to do it for real. The font-lock idea was
> perhaps not so bad...?
>
> --
> underground experts united
> http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573
> https://dataswamp.org/~incal
>
>
>

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Re: "text mode" org mode

[Emanuel Berg via General discussions about Org-mode.]

Gustavo Barros wrote:

> That's probably not something most Org users would
> do, but I think you'd get close to what you want
> with:
>
>     (add-hook 'org-mode-hook 'visible-mode)

Yeah, that seems to have done it? Great! Thanks a lot!

;;; -*- lexical-binding: t -*-
;;;
;;; this file:
;;;   http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573/emacs-init/org-my.el
;;;   https://dataswamp.org/~incal/emacs-init/org-my.el

(require 'mode-line)
(require 'org)
(require 'super)

(defun org-mode-set-keys ()
  (let ((the-map org-mode-map))
    (disable-super-global-keys the-map)
    (define-key the-map "\C-c\C-c" #'org-latex-export-to-pdf) ))

;; (setq org-mode-hook nil)
(defun org-mode-hook-f ()
  (auto-fill-mode -1)
  (enable-line-mode)
  (org-mode-set-keys)
  (visible-mode) )
(add-hook 'org-mode-hook #'org-mode-hook-f)

-- 
underground experts united
http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: "text mode" org mode

[tomas]

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On Tue, Sep 15, 2020 at 03:33:57PM +0200, Emanuel Berg via General discussions about Org-mode. wrote:
> Russell Adams wrote:
> 
> > I believe you can set your #+STARTUP on your file
> > to "showall".
> 
> Can I prevent hyperlinks from folding back and forth?
> 
> I mean, with [[][]] ?

Cf. the variable `org-link-descriptive' and its associated toggle
function `org-toggle-link-display' (also reachable via the menu
Org -> Links -> Descriptive ...)

There is an unproven conjecture by some mathematician from the
seventeenth century that Org contains everything. He wrote that
he had a proof, but that the margin of the book he just had at
hand was too narrow to write it down.

Therefore: buy only books with large margins, kids.

;-)

Cheers
 - t

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Re: "text mode" org mode

[Emanuel Berg via General discussions about Org-mode.]

Stefan Nobis wrote:

> (setq org-link-descriptive nil)

I don't have org-link-descriptive, it seems...

Org mode version 9.1.9 (release_9.1.9-65-g5e4542 @
/usr/share/emacs/26.1/lisp/org/)

GNU Emacs 26.1 (build 2, x86_64-pc-linux-gnu) of
2019-09-23, modified by Debian

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underground experts united
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https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: "text mode" org mode

[Stefan Nobis]

Emanuel Berg via "General discussions about Org-mode."
<emacs-orgmode@gnu.org> writes:

> Stefan Nobis wrote:

>> (setq org-link-descriptive nil)

> I don't have org-link-descriptive, it seems...

No problem, the old name is =org-descriptive-links= (this name has
been deprecated in Org 9.3, but it is still working in 9.4).

-- 
Until the next mail...,
Stefan.

Re: "text mode" org mode

[Emanuel Berg via General discussions about Org-mode.]

Stefan Nobis wrote:

>>> (setq org-link-descriptive nil)
>>
>> I don't have org-link-descriptive, it seems...
>
> No problem, the old name is =org-descriptive-links=
> (this name has been deprecated in Org 9.3, but it
> is still working in 9.4).

Thanks, I wonder tho if all this

  (setq org-descriptive-links      nil)
  (setq org-hide-emphasis-markers  nil)
  (setq org-startup-folded        'showeverything)

is implied, with `visual-mode'?

-- 
underground experts united
http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: "text mode" org mode

[Stefan Nobis]

Emanuel Berg via "General discussions about Org-mode."
<emacs-orgmode@gnu.org> writes:

> Thanks, I wonder tho if all this

>   (setq org-descriptive-links      nil)
>   (setq org-hide-emphasis-markers  nil)
>   (setq org-startup-folded        'showeverything)

> is implied, with `visual-mode'?

Beware: =visible-mode= not "visual"!

As far as I understand the internal of Org an Emacs, some of the
visual features of Org are implemented with overlays, some are
implemented with text properties. Disabling visible-mode just makes
invisible text visible - but I do not fully understand whether this
affects really all kinds of "invisibility" or just some.

So I for myself prefer to say Org explicitly what I want instead of
trying to take advantage of an indirect effect that may disturb Orgs
internal state (or not; I just do not understand enough of Org and
Emacs internals to really judge this).

-- 
Until the next mail...,
Stefan.