From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: =?utf-8?Q?Andr=C3=A9_A=2E_Gomes?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Do shorthands break basic tooling (tags, grep, etc)? (was Re: Shorthands have landed on master) Date: Thu, 30 Sep 2021 13:31:34 +0300 Message-ID: <87h7e2xsl5.fsf@gmail.com> References: <16338bdc2497fc51c6fb6d54ab370bfb@webmail.orcon.net.nz> <874ka5gsqa.fsf@gnus.org> <25d8d72022b571db5291@heytings.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="599"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.2 (gnu/linux) Cc: psainty@orcon.net.nz, Lars Ingebrigtsen , emacs-devel@gnu.org, Richard Stallman , joaotavora@gmail.com To: Gregory Heytings Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Sep 30 12:36:09 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mVtQ9-000ANf-A2 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 30 Sep 2021 12:36:09 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:39192 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mVtQ8-0006em-8b for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 30 Sep 2021 06:36:08 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:47078) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mVtLs-0002AZ-Ty for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 30 Sep 2021 06:31:44 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-lf1-x130.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::130]:34674) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mVtLp-0006kN-1T; Thu, 30 Sep 2021 06:31:44 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-lf1-x130.google.com with SMTP id g41so23234982lfv.1; Thu, 30 Sep 2021 03:31:38 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :user-agent:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=m7dzBMO+xg/k/pyg85dL5Zv5dKWbVh8qgXxgJcg2Gas=; b=q4UOB6bnA6pPFMG3bWuqQvBuil30vff8wDl+GtYv7DOpwkxKFwOYrfnxOU5o28ajTD uFQ+FNRl5RCu9XGrxGxfc+UbOwK/7ZaA+UeJGvkvuyhGSp5WxzYtcDQm/LvH6062aWDr xEPvR/mOuOhvWD55GGP4Mqki6neGOQzgqEK0qLoDoRUypa6ixmFE+kasPbclKG8XkgFS COro/pGrHAJqqK11YPHM9MkRhqTRtb2rkVVgVbbTAizesz8EawlyTyvL/1i96X2rtdvK 6FDWRURTnivZMSPfNynuizPE0+m6eUTzI38R6Vuj7B/ZK04VkvWCLhPYmSegt/eVWBEH PFEQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to :message-id:user-agent:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=m7dzBMO+xg/k/pyg85dL5Zv5dKWbVh8qgXxgJcg2Gas=; b=kl+QYeHYrATcQy0hRK2I+Np8XFr8z/HWr5IgeVwMIdqvzC0OC33NYhecjUUYIpuvlF E9p/siUM0tpG+fC3BLaANJdGuek618JhaxJFij3JlUCs/J0Rnnqd6UJ2sw8tNhCcMScI mHkRzHSZANOxK51kqVG3xqRZqH+ypdl54b26cUpd/x+3ngKC9zTXYCn3t2HPL4RFgSQU vnkOvlLYuUSJD5VSlnlQakIm+1zIobO4hBonDcKjEZtxUyXhOIjTfuFeQ0p5yu82py2R JCeX/nzlh+W5s2qjre1u/fUv6+Ad023Y1vhBoQsxP8qO28KgzdxtUBOciLUHSYgO0RQt fP5g== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5303oxXJHvOxGhaJgt1KmNl9tmUDYgr4+UOWcZf52aI5sQ/1fLzv a1iXR/yO0wO5XD74GX5OmYr+4Rt/ieK2Kg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwhKI+fSsrxbnQ5o1/URY+WPDPlctg0aG6x/CxDF/keT6b8EkY1Su4GKUySFyWRdyylcsXhCw== X-Received: by 2002:a19:f819:: with SMTP id a25mr5154026lff.252.1632997896771; Thu, 30 Sep 2021 03:31:36 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from guix-xps13 (95-29-46-69.broadband.corbina.ru. [95.29.46.69]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id r26sm321482lfi.293.2021.09.30.03.31.35 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Thu, 30 Sep 2021 03:31:36 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <25d8d72022b571db5291@heytings.org> (Gregory Heytings's message of "Thu, 30 Sep 2021 08:20:24 +0000") Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::130; envelope-from=andremegafone@gmail.com; helo=mail-lf1-x130.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:275868 Archived-At: Gregory Heytings writes: > A simple example: suppose you want to check which ELPA package > activates tab-bar-mode. That's easy to do with "grep -R tab-bar-mode" > in a clone of the ELPA repository. With symbol prefix renaming, a > package author might decide to add ("tb-" . "tab-bar-") in the > shorthands of the package, and "grep -R tab-bar-mode" will not show > anything. Likewise for tag systems, the symbols that are recorded > will possibly be different in each package, and a search for > tab-bar-mode will not return occurrences of tb-mode. I don't think this is a problem. Grep comes the world of Unix and its mantras. But Lisp REPLs come from another world. Using grep and tag systems to reason about a Lisp program is like eating soup with a fork. You can do it, but it's the wrong tool. -- Andr=C3=A9 A. Gomes "Free Thought, Free World"