From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Chong Yidong Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Reset buttons in Customize Date: Wed, 04 Jan 2006 15:00:51 -0500 Message-ID: <87fyo3epak.fsf@stupidchicken.com> References: <200512210254.jBL2sj814876@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <87d5jqrvuo.fsf@stupidchicken.com> <200512212219.jBLMJ3R29494@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <87lkydx021.fsf@stupidchicken.com> <200512220351.jBM3pvX02615@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <8764phpyvf.fsf@stupidchicken.com> <200512230029.jBN0TgT16314@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <1135392570.183714.29626.nullmailer@Update.UU.SE> <200512250324.jBP3OdM16529@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <200601022026.k02KQQh21528@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <877j9fg9j6.fsf_-_@stupidchicken.com> <200601041931.k04JV9x21284@raven.dms.auburn.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1136404958 28359 80.91.229.2 (4 Jan 2006 20:02:38 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 20:02:38 +0000 (UTC) Cc: ams@gnu.org, rms@gnu.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Jan 04 21:02:33 2006 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by ciao.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EuEpv-00089Y-Uw for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2006 21:02:20 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EuErc-0004qT-QK for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2006 15:04:04 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1EuEqT-0004NT-Qa for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2006 15:02:53 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1EuEqQ-0004JO-DL for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2006 15:02:52 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EuEqO-0004If-6N for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2006 15:02:49 -0500 Original-Received: from [18.19.6.82] (helo=localhost.localdomain) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1EuErA-0002IH-AF; Wed, 04 Jan 2006 15:03:36 -0500 Original-Received: by localhost.localdomain (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 9A290120900; Wed, 4 Jan 2006 15:00:51 -0500 (EST) Original-To: Luc Teirlinck In-Reply-To: <200601041931.k04JV9x21284@raven.dms.auburn.edu> (Luc Teirlinck's message of "Wed, 4 Jan 2006 13:31:09 -0600 (CST)") User-Agent: Gnus/5.11 (Gnus v5.11) Emacs/22.0.50 (gnu/linux) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:48710 Archived-At: > Why does it surprise you that a button that says "Reset to Saved" > actually resets to saved? Read my post again. The question is whether "Reset" means to make the saved value take effect in the Emacs session, or only display it in the Customize buffer widgets without affecting the current value. It is not a priori clear which meaning it has (in fact, my first guess would be the latter). > I suggest changing custom-reset-current and > custom-reset-saved to *really* become "Show Current Value" and "Show > Saved Value" (and custom-reset-2standard to "Show Standard Value"). > That is, the buttons only change the values shown in the widgets, > without setting them. The user explicitly calls "Set for Current > Session" or "Save for Future Sessions" to do what he wants, which > reduces the risk of confusion. > > That would mean two new whole buffer buttons and two new items in the > State menu. Nope -- the point is to *replace* the "reset to *" buttons, so there will be no change in the number of buttons. > However, an even better simplification is what I previously suggested: > do away with the concept of "set for current session", and make > Customize save automatically. > > I believe that many Custom users often use these buttons. I certainly > do. It's hard to judge this, especially if you want to take into account the number of users who don't use Customize because it is too confusing. Even in the worst case scenario, you can reset to the standard value and start again. > I believe that the changes you suggest are a bad idea. It is > _certainly_ a very bad idea to suggest these radical changes to > Custom supposedly "shortly" before a release. These do not entail very large changes to Custom internals. Anyway, other issues are holding the release.