From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Tassilo Horn Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: draft for DEL key poll Date: Wed, 28 Sep 2011 10:26:13 +0200 Message-ID: <87fwjhrs2i.fsf@thinkpad.tsdh.de> References: <87litcvtu2.fsf@stupidchicken.com> <87r532n6wr.fsf@stupidchicken.com> <20110928075430.GA2337@acm.acm> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1317198391 1692 80.91.229.12 (28 Sep 2011 08:26:31 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 28 Sep 2011 08:26:31 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Chong Yidong , rms@gnu.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Alan Mackenzie Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Sep 28 10:26:27 2011 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([140.186.70.17]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1R8pTG-0007Ta-Ow for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 28 Sep 2011 10:26:26 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:48365 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1R8pTF-0006cw-N2 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 28 Sep 2011 04:26:25 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.92]:47349) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1R8pTA-0006cc-Rj for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 28 Sep 2011 04:26:24 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1R8pT9-0005g0-Fy for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 28 Sep 2011 04:26:20 -0400 Original-Received: from deliver.uni-koblenz.de ([141.26.64.15]:34518) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1R8pT9-0005fk-BL; Wed, 28 Sep 2011 04:26:19 -0400 Original-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by deliver.uni-koblenz.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5EEC1A40BB; Wed, 28 Sep 2011 10:26:18 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at uni-koblenz.de Original-Received: from deliver.uni-koblenz.de ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (deliver.uni-koblenz.de [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qIrS1LF69DVn; Wed, 28 Sep 2011 10:26:18 +0200 (CEST) X-CHKRCPT: Envelopesender noch tassilo@member.fsf.org Original-Received: from thinkpad.tsdh.de (tsdh.uni-koblenz.de [141.26.67.142]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by deliver.uni-koblenz.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 01BBF1A40AC; Wed, 28 Sep 2011 10:26:17 +0200 (CEST) In-Reply-To: <20110928075430.GA2337@acm.acm> (Alan Mackenzie's message of "Wed, 28 Sep 2011 07:54:30 +0000") User-Agent: Gnus/5.110018 (No Gnus v0.18) Emacs/24.0.90 (gnu/linux) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-Received-From: 141.26.64.15 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:144436 Archived-At: Alan Mackenzie writes: Hi Alan, > I sincerely hope we won't be introducing too many more behaviours > which are "standard" in modern GUIs. Yes, I hope we incorporate (or invent) only behaviors that make sense and improve editing. And in this concrete case (or, say, comment-dwim, M-;), I actually like this special behavior. > > Some Emacs commands perform a certain operation on the region when > > it is active. In general, this "act on region" behavior does not > > draw a distinction between a region made with the mouse (or > > shift-selection) and a region made "normally" (e.g. by C-SPC > > followed by point motion). In previous Emacs releases, a special > > exception was made for the DEL and delete keys. This exception has > > now been dropped. > > I cannot let you get away with this epistemological conflation. These > other commands do not act _ON_ the region. They act _IN_ the region. > delete was not previously an exception - they did their normal thing > at the boundary of the region. Well, there's no way to be *not* at the boundary of the region, right? So there couldn't be any special behavior if at the region boundaries any command had to act "normally." > As a matter of interest, in the proposed default configuration, how > does one delete a single character at a boundary of an "active" > region? I deactivate the region (C-g), delete the character (DEL), and reactivate the region with `C-x C-x'. But this situation occurs (for me) much less frequently than the situation where I want to delete the complete active region, so I'm happy that I can now simply hit DEL instead of C-w. Bye, Tassilo