From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Basil L. Contovounesios" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#36717: 25.3; greek.el: deprecated vowel+oxia combinations should be replaced with vowel+tonos counterparts Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2019 21:52:19 +0100 Message-ID: <87ftn312ws.fsf@tcd.ie> References: <87zhlbaf5d.fsf@kiddo.i-did-not-set--mail-host-address--so-tickle-me> <20190718173252.GA3093@robertalessi.net> <87blxr2okn.fsf@tcd.ie> <20190718201948.GC4886@robertalessi.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: blaine.gmane.org; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:195.159.176.226"; logging-data="46664"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@blaine.gmane.org" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: Robert Pluim , 36717@debbugs.gnu.org To: Robert Alessi Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Jul 19 00:40:08 2019 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1hoF4K-000Bzd-BA for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Fri, 19 Jul 2019 00:40:08 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:41138 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.86_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hoF4J-0002F4-Ac for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 18 Jul 2019 18:40:07 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:58077) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.86_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hoF4G-0002Ek-AB for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 18 Jul 2019 18:40:05 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1hoF4F-0003Dp-4Q for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 18 Jul 2019 18:40:04 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]:45974) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1hoF4F-0003D2-0X for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 18 Jul 2019 18:40:03 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hoF4E-0002dM-S3 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 18 Jul 2019 18:40:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: "Basil L. 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Contovounesios wrote: >> Robert Alessi writes: >> > Very well spotted. Actually, the latter is the right one=E2=80=94that= is: >> > Greek Tonos, U+0384=E2=80=94while the former, Greek Oxia (U+1FFD) belo= ngs to >> > the group that was deprecated. So it is the other way round: keep the >> > former, and make the latter go. >>=20 >> AFAICT the link you provided does not say anything about oxia the >> standalone character. > > You are perfectly right. If it were up to me I would recommend to > keep all those characters that were considered as duplicates. I quote > here from this page[^1]: > > A false distinction was introduced to Unicode between the oxia > (acute) and tonos, resulting in wrongly duplicated code > points. See Greek Unicode duplicated vowels for a full > discussion. > > So strictly speaking, oxia alone is not yet removed from Unicode. [Are characters ever removed from Unicode?] > But as alpha, epsilon, eta, iota, omicron upsilon omega with oxia were > allegedly deprecated *and removed* from the Greek extended range, I > would say that oxia alone does not have much to live. Without being a Unicode expert, I doubt these vowel compositions or the oxia itself are going anywhere. The only question is whether it is safe and/or encouraged to replace oxia with tonos in all contexts, regardless of whether classical or modern, and how Quail might do this. At least, that's what I'm wondering. > [^1]: https://wiki.digitalclassicist.org/Unicode_for_ancient_languages >>=20 >> I'm still interested in seeing some documentation on this deprecation >> that is not from digitalclassicist.org. > > That, according to digitalclassicist.org, of course. I will try to > see if I find anything of relevance on unicode.org and report back. Thanks for looking into this! --=20 Basil