From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Morgan Willcock Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Make all tree-sitter modes optional Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2023 17:42:32 +0000 Message-ID: <87fsb49ojb.fsf@ice9.digital> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="34515"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.2 (gnu/linux) Cc: Dmitry Gutov , Eli Zaretskii , Po Lu , monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, acm@muc.de, juri@linkov.net, casouri@gmail.com, larsi@gnus.org, theo@thornhill.no, jostein@secure.kjonigsen.net, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Stefan Kangas Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Fri Feb 17 18:43:28 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1pT4lc-0008n2-8s for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 17 Feb 2023 18:43:28 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pT4l0-0000FL-V1; Fri, 17 Feb 2023 12:42:50 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pT4ky-0000C2-St for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 17 Feb 2023 12:42:48 -0500 Original-Received: from relay7-d.mail.gandi.net ([2001:4b98:dc4:8::227]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pT4kw-0005mt-H7; Fri, 17 Feb 2023 12:42:48 -0500 Original-Received: (Authenticated sender: morgan@ice9.digital) by mail.gandi.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 6DAD520002; Fri, 17 Feb 2023 17:42:36 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ice9.digital; s=gm1; t=1676655759; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=0zZtHmBiiHCjzrLiUROI6/VEYKGhM8jXTaaPaHvccGw=; b=gixHESiaiQZlNJkU4BtLHw4qDRJes1zKfB6qKbt32Cx+2vsG+GAoo92zhcESpKD9Vq73r9 YJLoVTZtum8v6bEcLwvqnVJeiM6GoyePDi07hUcH5PcY1Y1lhBSR24vLA3CcdUQB1GjCOw MrvMIUxmIXCgzMZ6t7eJ+aKkxaQ797xBr9t4y3lcdZqHnK25CEwf4CfQ5gRPIPE5R3Ow4y V+tXG8tO/JeiNng4/qhF86uxUkTY2p84jASFU0gMDsAoPbux/TWdjWLdzI5m4v0W1nO2IA rjGio5EMwCb4ZcEUJnDWhZGR5bqiQu5y3OCaFCClsk1aCH1EIHWxCOdggJa/kA== In-Reply-To: (Stefan Kangas's message of "Fri, 17 Feb 2023 08:04:20 -0800") Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2001:4b98:dc4:8::227; envelope-from=morgan@ice9.digital; helo=relay7-d.mail.gandi.net X-Spam_score_int: -27 X-Spam_score: -2.8 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.8 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:303507 Archived-At: Stefan Kangas writes: > Dmitry Gutov writes: > >> I just don't understand what's your plan here regarding Emacs 29. What's >> going to happen next? What kind of feedback will you be looking for? >> >> What I think will happen, is people will try out the new modes, some >> will suffer the inconveniences we warned about here and possibly think >> less of Emacs as a result; > > Changing Emacs' behavior upon loading a file is very bad. We already > know this (we even put it at the top of our coding conventions), and the > fix is trivial. So from my point of view, there is no need to wait for > users to tell us about it; we can act on it immediately. > > In comparison, I consider changing `auto-mode-alist' upon enabling a > major mode a mere annoyance. I'll be able to hack my way around it > myself, of course, but I think it will make for a bad user experience. > Especially since it breaks our existing conventions: users are not > trained to know that enabling a mode in one buffer will change > `auto-mode-alist' globally. It is surprising, to say the least. > > Restarting Emacs is not a solution at all. It breaks my workflow, and I > know that it breaks that of many users (e.g. those that start Emacs as a > daemon when logging in). And for someone using EXWM, requiring a restart is asking the user to logout and then login again. A slower and more stable path sounds more appealing to me. Morgan