From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Manoj Srivastava Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs vista build failures Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 09:36:39 -0500 Organization: Manoj Srivastava's Home Message-ID: <87ej5tkia0.fsf@anzu.internal.golden-gryphon.com> References: <4eb0089f0807111217m66d6cf4el777c197c107ce034@mail.gmail.com> <87skug6tq5.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <4eb0089f0807111345h13eccdds9b2cf43370b94074@mail.gmail.com> <4eb0089f0807121340x5e26f6dbve03ef50b238f3a3a@mail.gmail.com> <87k5fph5rh.fsf@stupidchicken.com> <20080713214648.GB1076@muc.de> <487A783B.7060603@gmail.com> <20080713232635.GD1076@muc.de> <85od51id2t.fsf@lola.goethe.zz> <20080714204242.GH6711@volo.donarmstrong.com> <85k5foch2r.fsf@lola.goethe.zz> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1216219048 27424 80.91.229.12 (16 Jul 2008 14:37:28 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 14:37:28 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Jul 16 16:38:09 2008 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1KJ88v-0001hi-Ff for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 16:38:09 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56112 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1KJ883-0005bs-1X for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 10:37:15 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KJ87y-0005bd-8l for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 10:37:10 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KJ87v-0005bP-IV for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 10:37:09 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=53126 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1KJ87v-0005bM-D5 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 10:37:07 -0400 Original-Received: from main.gmane.org ([80.91.229.2]:42192 helo=ciao.gmane.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1KJ87u-00016X-Ny for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 10:37:07 -0400 Original-Received: from list by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1KJ87p-0003iE-MT for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 14:37:01 +0000 Original-Received: from tiamat.golden-gryphon.com ([204.117.95.118]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 14:37:01 +0000 Original-Received: from srivasta by tiamat.golden-gryphon.com with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 14:37:01 +0000 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Mail-Followup-To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-Lines: 50 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: tiamat.golden-gryphon.com User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.0.60 (gnu/linux) (x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu) Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAACYAAAAwCAMAAABKbPgaAAAAM1BMVEUAAADIjH/0rp1KPz79 0b+ic2nlpJc2Ly2AY17VlYb4uqi2gHQXFBN2WVXgno5iT02Xa2Nx+jaIAAACVElEQVQ4jeWU23bj IAxFLUAggQX6/6+dI9LGTpo+9mlYiXNhc3TnOP50naZE0tqvgEk+soutnNfQ8yPTWMTENhNrjI+Y +N7POVt8tAzpn2vJlsmttbyfrdkP7hx5iezteGzsbOts7xT+tC1mcG+LtRP2X/16bEQExuyx1uZW vscrAWUT8aE0aDBeBuw8nS5u4WgWyDCllOZUBeyWgbWbGrBsTDpTx0qpphlcYPcgJLvBXFClPMg5 6WH2JidLIAaDF5aAed7uPTH4bjw0bZvfajp2tHc1F+cBm+Vr9YomGSwNhbmcczYEWUu5MBpYvCLV F+ZIKwQfYB+CBXnIRQFvIRhK6l96PemsFLEPFxi+MPxiTYH0Ave1InPsIYes3NJb42ytBSmmysyj lIQYHJm6Im1WbQ0kWMesKFRFPKTDzJ3GhWUn2KWKEkWlKthoACLm2eWJQQh2qKbAUgQxa+8TVjn1 aySm8656ookCfCc5TRzvnZ6YOu3NpHg+uR5YuRkNF/b5IHq5Y7Ve6c2+sR4hqIZ3+5DCt3ukh8Eo vFIXVJxqfMdbkd/BF3YaQkB/2RIUHPMS7RLVAHefrYzWZVQ/ei4peBsROFLi90ltQyvF5I05t4Zs L4C9DODJ2AZCUf8UitGjCIdfx15QQkfZibTOGT3edxns5fY6F2rstKcTwiiaJnQwvYkdzTlaTqNH IkSmGdLrON45tGsMNDoSYr4bxH5emHEFaoFjKBahHXFXfLx9cR9p6ejJXihuxPz57gWHZkWovbPl 9gsU8eImtBi++3D+f+sfT/Mg79fyEz8AAAAASUVORK5CYII= X-URL: http://www.golden-gryphon.com/ Mail-Copies-To: never X-Face: #q.#]5@vq!Jz+E0t_/; Y^gTjR\T^"B'fbeuVGiyKrvbfKJl!^e|e:iu(kJ6c|QYB57LP*|t &YlP~HF/=h:GA6o6W@I#deQL-%#.6]!z:6Cj0kd#4]>*D, |0djf'CVlXkI, >aV4\}?d_KEqsN{Nnt7 78"OsbQ["56/!nisvyB/uA5Q.{)gm6?q.j71ww.>b9b]-sG8zNt%KkIa>xWg&1VcjZk[hBQ>]j~`Wq Xl,y1a!(>6`UM{~'X[Y_,Bv+}=L\SS*mA8=s;!=O`ja|@PEzb&i0}Qp,`Z\:6:OmRi* Cancel-Lock: sha1:zYlNX6o9H7zKmJVkKV8/+oRm/qg= X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.6, seldom 2.4 (older, 4) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:100811 Archived-At: On Mon, 14 Jul 2008 23:05:16 +0200, David Kastrup said: > Don Armstrong writes: >> On Mon, 14 Jul 2008, David Kastrup wrote: >> >>> I know of _no_ upstream Emacs or XEmacs developer who claims to >>> understand or get along with the Debian setup. >> >> There's no need for upstream developers to bother, since it's all >> handled for them by Debian Developers. > Uh, upstream developers need to compile and test their work, too. And > it is not feasible to, say, arrange your own package in front of the > load-path somewhere in /usr/local/ since the Debian policy puts .el > files and .elc files in completely different directory hierarchies > (and different places in the load-path order), so things tend to get > mixed up if they are more than once in the load-path. Why does that matter for you in /usr/local? You can put all the .el and .elc files in the same directory. As an emacs developer, surely you can put a path in front of the system load path? I mean, a dumb-as-doornails Debian person like me can manage to add my elisp directories ahead of system paths, so surely an intelligent emacs developer can do so as well, unless they wanted to appear unable for the sake of a debating point. > As one consequence, the diagnostic tool M-x list-load-path-shadows RET > pretty much goes crazy on Debian. It is: A. /usr/share/ hiding /usr/share/emacs B. /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/ hiding /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/ Frankly, I don't call that going "pretty much crazy". but it does make a nice sound bite in a flamewar. > The only sane way out is to compile and manage your own Emacs and > packages. And that's what _all_ Emacs and XEmacs developers I know > who are not simultaneously Debian maintainers do. I think this is not the case, since a trivial work around is available (add your dir to the head of the path). manoj -- A black cat crossing your path signifies that the animal is going somewhere. Groucho Marx Manoj Srivastava 1024D/BF24424C print 4966 F272 D093 B493 410B 924B 21BA DABB BF24 424C