From: Alexis <flexibeast@gmail.com>
To: 20316@debbugs.gnu.org
Cc: michael.albinus@gmx.de
Subject: bug#20316: 24.5; `string-lessp' doesn't respect value of LC_COLLATE
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 2015 10:55:53 +1000 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <87egnn5y06.fsf@gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <83twwkccdk.fsf@gnu.org>
Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:
> Emacs is a multi-lingual editor, and it isn't clear how to apply
> locale-specific settings, including collation, to text that can
> potentially include many scripts. E.g., a locale could specify
> a codeset that doesn't cover characters outside of a particular
> script, which will produce undefined results if you try using
> system sorting routines with characters outside of that single
> script.
Okay, fair point.
> Also, using locale-specific sorting would produce different
> results not only in different locales, but also on different
> platforms in the same locale, because the implementation of
> locale collation order differs from platform to platform and
> from one C library to another.
Huh, okay.
> Please also note that locale-sensitive collation order could
> mean more than just order of characters. E.g., it could specify
> that punctuation characters or differences in accents should be
> ignored.
*nod*
> So by default, Emacs sorts disregarding locale-specific
> ordering, basically using the Unicode codepoints of the
> characters to order them.
This makes sense given what you've said above, but can this still
be referred to as 'lexicographic' ordering? To me, 'lexicographic
ordering' is ordering as per a dictionary for the relevant
language, not by codepoint for an arbitrary encoding. Is this
wrong?
> You could use the external 'sort' utility in the meantime, if it
> supports locale-dependent ordering. Once again: the results
> will be not 100% deterministic, even for the same locale, so
> your users should "caveat emptor".
*nod* Thanks, i'll pass that on. (And note it for the future.)
> May I ask what does that package of yours do that it needs
> locale-dependent sorting?
The package itself doesn't do it, but the results it produces
might subsequently require such sorting. The package is
`org-vcard':
https://github.com/flexibeast/org-vcard
which allows one to import vCards to contacts in Org-based formats
(and export contacts from Org-based formats to vCards).
One of the package's users had imported a set of contacts, then
expected to be able to sort those contacts according to Croatian
rules, using `org-sort' (from `org.el'). However, to quote the
user, this resulted in the contacts being sorted:
according to the English alphabet rules where the contact
entries which start with Croatian characters (Č,Ć,Đ,Š,Ž) are
at the end of the list, iow. after 'Z' entries, although it
should go like this:
A,B,C,Č,Ć,D,Dž,Đ,..S,Š,..Z,Ž
Alexis.
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2015-04-14 0:55 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 11+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2015-04-13 5:22 bug#20316: 24.5; `string-lessp' doesn't respect value of LC_COLLATE Alexis
2015-04-13 5:59 ` Alexis
2015-04-13 6:18 ` Michael Albinus
2015-04-13 6:42 ` Alexis
2015-04-13 6:53 ` Michael Albinus
2015-04-13 14:48 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-04-14 0:55 ` Alexis [this message]
2015-04-14 14:57 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-04-14 23:55 ` Alexis
2015-04-15 1:23 ` Stefan Monnier
2015-04-13 14:10 ` Paul Eggert
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