From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: Nicolas Goaziou Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.orgmode,gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Reconciling org-mode idiosyncrasies with Emacs core Date: Wed, 29 Apr 2020 14:30:44 +0200 Message-ID: <87ees6fp8r.fsf@nicolasgoaziou.fr> References: <20200426172206.GC18629@ACM> <87y2qhnc9a.fsf@gmail.com> <20200427102311.GA4976@ACM> <87mu6xtano.fsf@gmail.com> <87k120ohsq.fsf@mail.linkov.net> <87blnbir01.fsf@nicolasgoaziou.fr> <87o8rbmbfa.fsf@mail.linkov.net> <87k11yftqo.fsf@nicolasgoaziou.fr> <87pnbqo74t.fsf_-_@gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="112170"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/26.3 (gnu/linux) Cc: Emacs developers , Org Mode list , Juri Linkov To: =?utf-8?Q?K=C3=A9vin?= Le Gouguec Original-X-From: emacs-orgmode-bounces+geo-emacs-orgmode=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Apr 29 14:33:14 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: geo-emacs-orgmode@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jTltq-000T4I-MR for geo-emacs-orgmode@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 29 Apr 2020 14:33:14 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:48734 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jTltp-0003cS-O0 for geo-emacs-orgmode@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 29 Apr 2020 08:33:13 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:55860) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jTlt1-0003Yg-8d for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Wed, 29 Apr 2020 08:32:24 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jTlsu-0005vv-Dc for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Wed, 29 Apr 2020 08:32:22 -0400 Original-Received: from relay3-d.mail.gandi.net ([217.70.183.195]:51401) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jTlrX-0003ho-H6; Wed, 29 Apr 2020 08:30:51 -0400 X-Originating-IP: 185.131.40.67 Original-Received: from localhost (40-67.ipv4.commingeshautdebit.fr [185.131.40.67]) (Authenticated sender: admin@nicolasgoaziou.fr) by relay3-d.mail.gandi.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 1BD726000F; Wed, 29 Apr 2020 12:30:46 +0000 (UTC) Mail-Followup-To: =?utf-8?Q?K=C3=A9vin?= Le Gouguec , Juri Linkov , Emacs developers , Org Mode list In-Reply-To: <87pnbqo74t.fsf_-_@gmail.com> (=?utf-8?Q?=22K=C3=A9vin?= Le Gouguec"'s message of "Wed, 29 Apr 2020 13:37:06 +0200") Received-SPF: pass client-ip=217.70.183.195; envelope-from=mail@nicolasgoaziou.fr; helo=relay3-d.mail.gandi.net X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: First seen = 2020/04/29 08:30:48 X-ACL-Warn: Detected OS = Linux 3.11 and newer [fuzzy] X-Received-From: 217.70.183.195 X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+geo-emacs-orgmode=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.orgmode:128760 gmane.emacs.devel:248121 Archived-At: Hello, K=C3=A9vin Le Gouguec writes: > Nicolas Goaziou writes: > >> For example, having RET >> inserting a plain newline would be a disaster in many locations. > > I don't think I've seen anybody advocating for that! If you are > referring to this bit: > >> (Frustratingly, org-mode uses what I think of as the "old" convention >> to use RET as "plain newline" and C-j as "smart newline with indent".) No I wasn't. I was referring to Juri Linkov's idea of providing a minor mode to disable every single Org specific binding. > Do you think a patch that > > - tweaked org-return (bound to RET) to default its INDENT argument to > the current value of electric-indent-mode, > > - tweaked org-return-indent (bound to C-j) to call > electric-newline-and-maybe-indent (the new default binding for C-j > everywhere else in Emacs, which takes care of consulting > electric-indent-mode) instead of newline-and-indent, > > would be well-received? I would love to cook up such a patch, but I > would be loath to break the workflows of long-time Org users who have > come to rely on C-j indenting and RET inserting plain newlines =E2=80=A6 It will break some workflows (mine, at least), undoubtedly, but it is a step forward anyway. Org is a part of Emacs, there's no reason for the former to follow a different path than the latter. Besides, undoing the change is easy enough, since you only need to disable Electric Indent mode. The change will not appear overnight in Org, i.e., not in Org stable's branch (Org 9.3.X), and it will be announced in ORG-NEWS. I do think it is a very welcome change. Thank you. I cleaned a bit Cc header and added Org mode list for further comments. Regards, --=20 Nicolas Goaziou