From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Philip Kaludercic Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Elisp LSP Server Date: Wed, 06 Oct 2021 21:22:25 +0000 Message-ID: <87ee8xq25q.fsf@posteo.net> References: <16338bdc2497fc51c6fb6d54ab370bfb@webmail.orcon.net.nz> <87ee99dv34.fsf@gmail.com> <07cf50ddddb5a9556aa94201a7ac88c9@webmail.orcon.net.nz> <87r1d0562u.fsf@yahoo.com> <87r1cz7qcd.fsf@posteo.net> <87bl4367av.fsf@yahoo.com> <87fstf7kz4.fsf@posteo.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="5741"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Richard Stallman Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Oct 06 23:23:45 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mYEO9-0001LN-Jl for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 06 Oct 2021 23:23:45 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:55194 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mYEO7-0004yK-TD for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 06 Oct 2021 17:23:44 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:48314) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mYEN8-0004GV-6j for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 06 Oct 2021 17:22:42 -0400 Original-Received: from mout02.posteo.de ([185.67.36.66]:60661) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mYEMw-0000zk-67 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 06 Oct 2021 17:22:41 -0400 Original-Received: from submission (posteo.de [89.146.220.130]) by mout02.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9B720240106 for ; Wed, 6 Oct 2021 23:22:26 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1633555346; bh=lldNfrzRsed3lRvyCSkDeFXUsfJkL9A+bO3iCWAlPDc=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Autocrypt:Date:From; b=ke6snXk4rleqdkp2PDRasouGL+8j8F0OHehvugQfFUh7hmTYdgJPFted+oGFDcfBV BSh5fQxz+BBeFIFHSlSWITVRaza3ofvqzQDNMQbDxccnzvRiRZYOqoYCOfwrb+RDXP VZGaGv42oxOoXbPVMsllVuDFo8mPnv7eapKi3CQH6/LndhemDGEAuTMUXvWjY8f3DI AYU20g4MBVqXDaEoMcDaVHI8VP5URrGJCJw+4HzChYMyb54YrPMqe2uA9sUYkvoJ1P W2KucK+d1yMF1bidJwG+KRTnxoyeUBpEDu9ob/lA6MqmhzXo4J+EK40/CrAHF8gxoN fy7Rxf2yNBdAQ== Original-Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4HPnTt0w7Rz9rxS; Wed, 6 Oct 2021 23:22:25 +0200 (CEST) Autocrypt: addr=philipk@posteo.net; prefer-encrypt=nopreference; keydata= mDMEYHHqUhYJKwYBBAHaRw8BAQdAp3GdmYJ6tm5McweY6dEvIYIiry+Oz9rU4MH6NHWK0Ee0QlBo aWxpcCBLYWx1ZGVyY2ljIChnZW5lcmF0ZWQgYnkgYXV0b2NyeXB0LmVsKSA8cGhpbGlwa0Bwb3N0 ZW8ubmV0PoiQBBMWCAA4FiEEDM2H44ZoPt9Ms0eHtVrAHPRh1FwFAmBx6lICGwMFCwkIBwIGFQoJ CAsCBBYCAwECHgECF4AACgkQtVrAHPRh1FyTkgEAjlbGPxFchvMbxzAES3r8QLuZgCxeAXunM9gh io0ePtUBALVhh9G6wIoZhl0gUCbQpoN/UJHI08Gm1qDob5zDxnIHuDgEYHHqUhIKKwYBBAGXVQEF AQEHQNcRB+MUimTMqoxxMMUERpOR+Q4b1KgncDZkhrO2ql1tAwEIB4h4BBgWCAAgFiEEDM2H44Zo Pt9Ms0eHtVrAHPRh1FwFAmBx6lICGwwACgkQtVrAHPRh1Fw1JwD/Qo7kvtib8jy7puyWrSv0MeTS g8qIxgoRWJE/KKdkCLEA/jb9b9/g8nnX+UcwHf/4VfKsjExlnND3FrBviXUW6NcB In-Reply-To: (Richard Stallman's message of "Wed, 06 Oct 2021 16:57:11 -0400") Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.66; envelope-from=philipk@posteo.net; helo=mout02.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:276463 Archived-At: Richard Stallman writes: > [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] > [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] > [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > > > > I think it is dangerous for Emacs to "integrate" with such proprietary > > > software. It would make people gravitate towards that software. > > Po Lu is right. > > > That yes, but that is an inherent problem of LSP (e.g. see how VSCode > > can automatically download and run a propitiatory LSP server like > > Pylance), and not the "." command itself. > > Can you please explain the problem that you're talking about? If it > is true that LSP inherently tends to use nonfree LSP servers, then > using LSP is inherently a problem, and maybe we should not include > that feature in Emacs at all. I don't think that this is currently the case, most LSP servers I know of are free software. The difference between Emacs (at least Eglot) and other LSP implementations, is that the latter can download servers automatically. This is done without regard to the license, as projects like VSCode are not focused on software freedom. The intent is to take care of setting up a server without the user having to care, but the effect is that actual programs, possibly propitiatory, are being downloaded and run on the host system. > Or can we fix that problem? Maybe loading nonfree servers is not > totally inherent -- maybe we can arrange to avoid it. Of course. Currently the problem doesn't exist to begin with, since LSP servers have to be installed manually for Emacs. If LSP clients for Emacs were to automatically configure a server, then I do think that the licensing should be seriously taken into consideration. > > I think a better solution to Ag's problem is to make editing online > > repositories easier, without to manually clone a directory every time. > > Would you spell out in more detail what you're thinking of? Perhaps this > would be a solution, but what is the solution, and what is the problem? The problem is when you are browsing the online interface of a source code repository, you might decide to want to make a change. This introduces friction in the user's workflow, because you have to find a directory, the repository has to be cloned into said directory, opened in Emacs and then you can start working. GitHub has introduced a feature where a in-browser Editor (derived from VSCode as far as I see) can be invoked by literally at the press of a button. Everything has been initialized, and you can make your changes in a matter of seconds. Replicating this for Emacs seems hard to do, but it is probably the wrong approach. My guess would be that most people wouldn't want Emacs in a browser. A solution could be to provide a script or command that automatically clones a repository to a temporary directory and opens Emacs (possibly by making use of emacsclient). The tricky part would be to integrate this into a web browser, but my guess would be that this could be done by use of a browser extension. This would recognize the website, extract the git repository and start the script. Haven't tried any of this, it is just brainstorming. -- Philip Kaludercic