From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Carson Chittom Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#15095: 24.2; mail items in Tools menu confusing to new users Date: Thu, 15 Aug 2013 12:23:55 -0500 Message-ID: <87d2pevpec.fsf@abbey.wistly.net> References: <87y584tdzu.fsf@abbey.wistly.net> <837gfop2r7.fsf@gnu.org> <87ob90uk62.fsf@abbey.wistly.net> <8338qbpt90.fsf@gnu.org> <87mwojqi0i.fsf@abbey.wistly.net> <83wqnnngib.fsf@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1376587519 19067 80.91.229.3 (15 Aug 2013 17:25:19 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 15 Aug 2013 17:25:19 +0000 (UTC) Cc: 15095@debbugs.gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Aug 15 19:25:19 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1VA1IV-0000gU-B8 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 15 Aug 2013 19:25:19 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:54669 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VA1IU-0004VC-UV for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 15 Aug 2013 13:25:18 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:36284) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VA1IL-0004S1-4d for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 15 Aug 2013 13:25:15 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VA1IE-0001lI-HU for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 15 Aug 2013 13:25:09 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.43]:38336) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VA1IE-0001l9-F6 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 15 Aug 2013 13:25:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VA1ID-0003E5-MV for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 15 Aug 2013 13:25:01 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Carson Chittom Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Thu, 15 Aug 2013 17:25:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 15095 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 15095-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B15095.137658744512324 (code B ref 15095); Thu, 15 Aug 2013 17:25:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 15095) by debbugs.gnu.org; 15 Aug 2013 17:24:05 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:60885 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VA1HJ-0003Ch-43 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 15 Aug 2013 13:24:05 -0400 Original-Received: from nm20-vm6.access.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com ([216.109.115.117]:37475) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VA1HG-0003C5-Ud for 15095@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 15 Aug 2013 13:24:03 -0400 Original-Received: from [66.196.81.155] by nm20.access.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Aug 2013 17:23:57 -0000 Original-Received: from [98.138.226.241] by tm1.access.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Aug 2013 17:23:57 -0000 Original-Received: from [127.0.0.1] by smtp112.sbc.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Aug 2013 17:23:57 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 334966.15140.bm@smtp112.sbc.mail.ne1.yahoo.com X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 X-YMail-OSG: o42OJ1wVM1nt4FzwILDREzo1hq4hdGQRES4iJ0_dMz5Slcl jf.JBfTppPG.ww_SKzxnidFpnwuj0evs7ITYtJyvJztIIyHp.1MAm1vpIVOp d8ODR2yBQPY3NO1ZSnbmDr5UNq87O93FwNcMUbMefCsJjkusjxY105dEnXXI qckcPKI3WcsLZ9PE85JLvPWxyrFhqiNtwbFVp0esa1P6Wvikf0YVh3Xe2ULg 7goN5zTxgiMQTeTFHrVJD2O32hxhpMiWU0_X0bXfbKK_B2CNM1V0gjW6SUPZ GL5QpDkXx.gSgDwGEi233s1NzotzDwOQGpcHrR4I6ZZ57RhaT2q9A8xDQp6G aIfmfq8j95Up_W76g_bg5tvq60v_gZsbCQXJCGnOf9b1Q_Jk6kk8Ww56dK.l 9RL6hNZg5qFt_ZndXdoknSG3lT3Q6ZtQ0PlvRWrA3EwPgQxtbukMi83RCua4 sqFu3k_J22GDqDAT1MPWwgtZMXy2ETQ1EodEwEi7nw_Gm6aZHhbJ5Ntdy.YP peTgMFp4.a33jrw-- X-Yahoo-SMTP: hZyeSdyswBAntTRwE4iHeNvlTr4tnw.ghKUIbT6L X-Rocket-Received: from abbey.wistly.net (carson@108.131.113.89 with plain) by smtp112.sbc.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Aug 2013 10:23:57 -0700 PDT Original-Received: from localhost (1000@localhost [local]); by abbey.wistly.net (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id 9bc16fdd; Thu, 15 Aug 2013 12:23:55 -0500 (CDT) In-Reply-To: <83wqnnngib.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Thu, 15 Aug 2013 18:03:08 +0300") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.2 (berkeley-unix) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 140.186.70.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:77396 Archived-At: Eli Zaretskii writes: > As you well know, that "Message" thing is the current major mode. It > was "Rmail" when you were in Rmail. Yes, *I* know that, and *you* know that. But my point is that this bug report is not about me or you, it's about being confusing to a *new* user, one who is unfamiliar with Emacs. When I first began using Emacs several years ago, I didn't even know what the mode line was, much less that I should look at it. All I knew was that Emacs was this text editor that a lot of people talked about and which could do various things in addition to editing text. In any case, it seems obvious that you've already decided to leave three menu items. I still believe it's confusing to new users, but I've exhausted my interest in discussing it. Please feel free to close this report as Will Not Fix or whatever is appropriate.