From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Robert Pluim Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: ESC vs Meta for shifted keys Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 18:16:43 +0200 Message-ID: <87d0z4e6xg.fsf@gmail.com> References: <87d0z71985.fsf@gmail.com> <20180410164730086770438@bob.proulx.com> <20180411131107072594795@bob.proulx.com> <87r2nkq06a.fsf@gmail.com> <874lkgsc9m.fsf@gmail.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1523549744 17117 195.159.176.226 (12 Apr 2018 16:15:44 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 16:15:44 +0000 (UTC) Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org, Stefan Monnier To: Drew Adams Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Apr 12 18:15:40 2018 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1f6est-0004KK-G3 for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 12 Apr 2018 18:15:39 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:51670 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1f6ev0-0005ip-3I for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 12 Apr 2018 12:17:50 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:35998) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1f6eu3-0005hb-A6 for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 12 Apr 2018 12:16:52 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1f6ety-0003To-Bd for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 12 Apr 2018 12:16:51 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-wm0-x231.google.com ([2a00:1450:400c:c09::231]:37319) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1f6ety-0003SN-5G for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 12 Apr 2018 12:16:46 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-wm0-x231.google.com with SMTP id l16so6866123wmh.2 for ; Thu, 12 Apr 2018 09:16:46 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:mail-copies-to:gmane-reply-to-list :date:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=Cd2m+5oE8tYaEl2mHiEYN8qET/UA3o67cnq8trZ0E0s=; b=mt4AkqWuK+NmX78MRO/T7/F1Y4sT0110McUq7iUJAWPMhmoeMh201SjLUsbSkGK5y7 2lnWYg9J/DE4nuMMeOz/IQ8WGfhJrlYyQhEBfidL8FROWUwrYpGlVD3AlOc3hHZCTfuw GRDuuF/9PgPUqigylAcbM+YddZdz4Q3Jh5bJhTzYbD6I38oOO4ektZ2fN40h8Uj6XzT9 oqqkUKfvIumf0imSPlg50zXQPGwrVphGQbUUnshFRccWaH9BGZwusoOiIUMNDYfF1GFJ VTAv1ZE/pYtzgvzEHlF6PdonsolUUWSOgV5pt2SmgntKmMYNqfzXwBwOeXF5IkZI0qTJ +2UA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:references:mail-copies-to :gmane-reply-to-list:date:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding; bh=Cd2m+5oE8tYaEl2mHiEYN8qET/UA3o67cnq8trZ0E0s=; b=ZQke1sovsVMs8j6/Ll3X8Wkw8LkF95qsiNnHtcONABMNQPGdTn9ICOVyUiZx0pkPn/ XcTChE2wsIPiP+gi1zcVgAPtIFehDxw7ge1YBJcyQdXX9v8pPHZ9445QixB9SDacAHk9 SQb8XVnIFIEbTy64qsX30n4ZDZyTMGmenPaXMOSSXWsecvD3R+Xngzu7+LqDEz6SEubr yvxv1epfbMNXtOvUSBiwhIK/pgNYhhexIhc1wDy8RjeIBeBe5f3Y2C97nP25YNfhFVVR 2G3c5RPPG0b9ojA5Bh4H+1VTCSMolrjzwwW5vFvtViDpL5YHCJPd5GccaaTtjkvpTn2c CI1A== X-Gm-Message-State: ALQs6tB2KA9FBLcfIFCK7/GzRRP1FwVLrm8n6ZpLNtcvRhyc+IZHvYBD TKNFoOfHFpnremc2L/fU9fl6KyMpGf4= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AIpwx4+CR56zJbzRyJIBXb5YXtJIOTkHyTJynPgfD5jCn7XCO0JK85PU+gI7UjZPUaQH1d2nYZiKzA== X-Received: by 10.28.234.207 with SMTP id g76mr1257173wmi.149.1523549805042; Thu, 12 Apr 2018 09:16:45 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from rpluim-ubuntu ([149.5.228.1]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id a70sm2647696wma.27.2018.04.12.09.16.44 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 12 Apr 2018 09:16:44 -0700 (PDT) Mail-Copies-To: never Gmane-Reply-To-List: yes In-Reply-To: (Drew Adams's message of "Thu, 12 Apr 2018 09:02:08 -0700 (PDT)") X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 2a00:1450:400c:c09::231 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "help-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:116497 Archived-At: Drew Adams writes: >> It looks deliberate to me (and sensible). >> Only the global bindings were changed: >>=20=20 >> -(global-set-key [M-right] 'forward-word) >> +(global-set-key [M-right] 'right-word) >> (define-key esc-map [right] 'forward-word) >> -(global-set-key [M-left] 'backward-word) >> +(global-set-key [M-left] 'left-word) >> (define-key esc-map [left] 'backward-word) > > Right, and that's I expected too. > > And Eli basically confirms that it was deliberate, > but doesn't recall just why it was done. (Depending > on what "mistake" might mean, he perhaps also allowed > for it to have just been an oversight.) > > The bottom line is that it's not clear why it > was done, and it's not clear what the right > behavior/choice would be now. It=CA=BCs pretty clear to me: the current situation allows users of R2L text to choose visual or logical moving without impacting L2R users at all, so I see no need to change anything. > These are only default bindings, so whatever > choice is made it's not the end of the world. This is emacs, after all :-)