From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Lee Sau Dan Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Making Emacs more newbie friendly Date: 20 Mar 2005 00:04:32 +0800 Organization: InterNetNews at News.BelWue.DE (Stuttgart, Germany) Message-ID: <87acozbp0v.fsf@informatik.uni-freiburg.de> References: <874qf8d3cy.fsf@thalassa.informatimago.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=big5 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1111248379 10794 80.91.229.2 (19 Mar 2005 16:06:19 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 16:06:19 +0000 (UTC) Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Mar 19 17:06:19 2005 Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by ciao.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1DCgSs-0003eV-0y for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 19 Mar 2005 17:06:14 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1DCgja-0007cc-MJ for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 19 Mar 2005 11:23:30 -0500 Original-Path: shelby.stanford.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!news.tele.dk!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!inka.de!rz.uni-karlsruhe.de!news.belwue.de!not-for-mail Original-Newsgroups: gnu.emacs.help Original-Lines: 74 Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: gela.informatik.uni-freiburg.de Original-X-Trace: news.BelWue.DE 1111248273 15090 132.230.167.5 (19 Mar 2005 16:04:33 GMT) Original-X-Complaints-To: news@news.belwue.de Original-NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 16:04:33 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.3 Original-Xref: shelby.stanford.edu gnu.emacs.help:129405 Original-To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org X-MailScanner-To: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:24960 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.help:24960 >>>>> "David" =3D=3D David Kastrup writes: >> Four fundamental issues would be: [1] Possibility for >> horizontal scroll, David> C-x < and C-x > Or C-PageUp and C-PageDown >> [2] sizeable and cascadable windows instead of buffers inside >> the same frame, David> Windows _are_ sizable, and what is displayed _is_ a window, David> not a buffer (you can have buffers that are not displayed, David> or buffers displyed in several windows at once). Drag an David> unused spot of any modeline in a split frame (C-x 2) up and David> down or use C-x ^ to enlarge. If you split windows David> vertically (with C-x 3), drag the point in the mode line David> under the scrollbar left and right. I like Emacs the way it is: windows dividing the frame into different areas. I hate overlapping windows or tabs because they make reading 2 buffers (or two different parts of the same buffer) side-by-side difficult. 'Windows' in Emacs is appropriate for that. Please don't change that. If you want multiple frames, then C-x 5 2 yourself. >> [3] heavy extension of the icon toolbars and=20 I don't care. I have (tool-bar-mode -1) in my .emacs anyway. >> [4] distinction between 'open' and 'new' file. David> The problems with "new" (basically nameless buffers) are: David> a) There is no associated mode. Emacs' most important David> property is that it has editing modes and syntax David> highlighting and keybindings for most tasks readily David> available. It will almost always be easier to specify a David> file name to work with than the name of an Emacs mode. David> b) There is no associated file name. When exiting and David> saving automatically (like the desktop package does), Emacs David> has no place to put the file. David> c) There is no associated autosave file. If you crash David> after two hours of work, your work will get lost. David> d) Lots of modes offer running/compiling/testing your David> program using external tools that need accessible files. David> In short: I don't see how Emacs can benefit from that David> distinction. But Emacs does provide a way for you to do that effectively: C-x b *untitled1* RET. (Or C-x 4 b ..., which is what I usually do.) The result is a new windows in fundamental-mode and no associated filename (C-x C-s would prompt you to enter a file name). I often do that to create extra *scratch* buffers to hold temp. data -- electronic rough work sheets. --=20 Lee Sau Dan =A7=F5=A6u=B4=B0 ~= {@nJX6X~} E-mail: danlee@informatik.uni-freiburg.de Home page: http://www.informatik.uni-freiburg.de/~danlee