From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Bastien Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs as word processor Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2013 18:43:51 +0100 Message-ID: <87a9gx8xbc.fsf@bzg.ath.cx> References: <5288A59E.7030109@dancol.org> <87vbzqfgd6.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <87mwl04w3k.fsf@zigzag.favinet> <83zjoyewgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87fvqqi09q.fsf@bzg.ath.cx> <83hab5en6u.fsf@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1385109789 8822 80.91.229.3 (22 Nov 2013 08:43:09 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2013 08:43:09 +0000 (UTC) Cc: ttn@gnu.org, asr@ufl.edu, rms@gnu.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Nov 22 09:43:14 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1VjmKX-0001A5-W7 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 22 Nov 2013 09:43:14 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:37531 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VjmKX-0004Xf-DT for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 22 Nov 2013 03:43:13 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:42675) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VjmKP-0004XV-NN for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 22 Nov 2013 03:43:11 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VjmKK-0001R1-CU for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 22 Nov 2013 03:43:05 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-wg0-x235.google.com ([2a00:1450:400c:c00::235]:53319) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VjmKE-0001Q4-Eu; Fri, 22 Nov 2013 03:42:54 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-wg0-f53.google.com with SMTP id b13so823238wgh.8 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2013 00:42:53 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=sender:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:references:user-agent:date :message-id:mime-version:content-type; bh=b42IE5draYnHlOMG6EcZqk2V5SEbXcixtybFQE5TdSk=; b=og6BfKL/SmpgVvaNKAezPXEEc7Y3l7xKg8D5wvFoutWNQK+xHpJBo07/jP1IorO3zc 86GiDCJsCxIwMGF924IFHHbhlAqtgSmxi78dI0t+QiUhBHlbChsyFf85CMmGWGbTxxyh kyjUShR6jtuqkUlH1zjGZ41SC1BxycQWd99sTiw1ZkYH0WvpvXEw8ZdjnLvQWjjOcnWb riDYtHGyNwE9pae5ba0O3wO/LFL+A7lG+y9jZNb6RxoZ676UHpOyourwB1LHixCnmytq QDXVM95cpwgCku1IS32n9wnxUa9QSsLGJoGix5zF/kUM/xpiLiECZqvunPVeco4T0UNl 2+Uw== X-Received: by 10.180.188.194 with SMTP id gc2mr1527800wic.53.1385109773243; Fri, 22 Nov 2013 00:42:53 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: from bzg.localdomain (mar75-2-81-56-68-112.fbx.proxad.net. [81.56.68.112]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id ll10sm13495397wic.9.2013.11.22.00.42.50 for (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 22 Nov 2013 00:42:50 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: by bzg.localdomain (Postfix, from userid 1000) id BBD701C20880; Thu, 21 Nov 2013 18:43:51 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: <83hab5en6u.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Thu, 21 Nov 2013 18:26:01 +0200") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.3.50 (gnu/linux) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2a00:1450:400c:c00::235 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:165544 Archived-At: Eli Zaretskii writes: > Thanks, but you could assume I knew about Org (and use it ;-). Sorry, I know you have been (and are still?) using Org! Richard: please try Org-mode and its export facilities, I think it will help turning the discussion into something more constructive. >> If (La)TeX is installed on the machine, this will open a PDF file. > > Sorry, but this is not WYSIWYG. WYSIWYG means you see the text you > type in its final presentation form, or close to that. It does not > mean you type into one buffer/window and see the result in another; > that is a step backwards from user expectations, certainly nowadays. Of course you're right. But WYSIWYG as LibreOffice does it solves really two problems: one is the real WYSIWYG part (to edit a document with rich text formatting), the other one is a social one (to edit a document as others will see it.) With Org-mode, both problems are solved *indirectly*, by allowing to export your .org file to another popular formats that you can print and share. If the purpose is to solve the first problem within the Emacs world, then enriched-mode is a good place to continue, though I think Org also solves the problem and is more handy. If the purpose is to solve the second problem, I think the solution I proposed comes close. Finally, solving both problems... well, I don't know. >> I guess that'd suit most of Richard needs, but it's hard to tell. > > Visit etc/enriched.doc to get an idea. Oops! Bug: it's opened through DocView with emacs -Q. I C-c C-c and could see it -- nice. > Of course, that file and > enriched.el are dormant for the last 20 years, so don't expect too > much. But it could be a starting point, and the display engine gained > a lot of functionality that was missing in 1994. Yes, but this solution is just for Emacs people. LibreOffice is popular not only because it's WYSIWYG, but also because it's solves the problem of exchanging documents with Word-people. At least that's my guess! 2.5 cents, -- Bastien