From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: phillip.lord@russet.org.uk (Phillip Lord) Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Unbalanced change hooks (part 2) [Documentation fix still remaining] Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2016 14:30:13 +0100 Message-ID: <87a8fue656.fsf@russet.org.uk> References: <83inv9hkjd.fsf@gnu.org> <83h9ashfgx.fsf@gnu.org> <831t1wharr.fsf@gnu.org> <20160810161821.GB3413@acm.fritz.box> <83wpjofttf.fsf@gnu.org> <20160810185735.GD3413@acm.fritz.box> <20160811112951.GA2154@acm.fritz.box> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1472563939 31193 195.159.176.226 (30 Aug 2016 13:32:19 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2016 13:32:19 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.1 (gnu/linux) Cc: Alan Mackenzie , Stefan Monnier , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Daniel Colascione Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Aug 30 15:32:09 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bej95-0006vN-Cj for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 30 Aug 2016 15:32:07 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:49214 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bej92-0005Hc-VO for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 30 Aug 2016 09:32:04 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:60961) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bej7M-0004Qa-6p for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 30 Aug 2016 09:30:24 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bej7I-0005p2-2L for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 30 Aug 2016 09:30:20 -0400 Original-Received: from cloud103.planethippo.com ([31.216.48.48]:42241) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bej7H-0005op-P5 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 30 Aug 2016 09:30:16 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=russet.org.uk; s=default; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID: In-Reply-To:Date:References:Subject:Cc:To:From; bh=XhQju4Z4XWVMJ8Pw4lAukSQWq1PqOBxmeoQg1yMExIM=; b=B5un7RC23Ti9C/HOcQ9F8dxJv7 +AUXxvWqyGB/JuNwmeAhC6h0QuiaxQIGLOPY/N2Zj+NRBTrkFtdK/thdH4KbCf81pssuDrspzs8p5 +k2mT1eV45jiqhWdtQfKZ71uboX+WfH9VSCv2cl0c+6hdsPe1ZBRLdzAWywr0kXdOWw5/qGnuNX0+ 54NuRMVgnpGvb0/Qbq3k8ZvuashHuY2uL4CGvRbwMnVuIx8jYC/dguzJoLqRVqZp4/140anp1KhLF qMFikZw0r5IZm/6XsbVjhChkxJ8LyDZITzvGUw45YAD54SfxyLo9U/Bf5hZeRw1JJTpXDzTrK/jhk F6Vdbevw==; Original-Received: from janus-nat-128-240-225-60.ncl.ac.uk ([128.240.225.60]:41595 helo=russet.org.uk) by cloud103.planethippo.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256:128) (Exim 4.86_1) (envelope-from ) id 1bej7F-001UaI-OO; Tue, 30 Aug 2016 14:30:13 +0100 In-Reply-To: (Daniel Colascione's message of "Sun, 28 Aug 2016 04:23:32 -0700") X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - cloud103.planethippo.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - gnu.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - russet.org.uk X-Get-Message-Sender-Via: cloud103.planethippo.com: authenticated_id: phillip.lord@russet.org.uk X-Authenticated-Sender: cloud103.planethippo.com: phillip.lord@russet.org.uk X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 31.216.48.48 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:206929 Archived-At: Daniel Colascione writes: >> As mentioned in my so-called "hand-waving", any details you may need can >> be stored somewhere for use. > > Is it really better to force that complexity (which, in the limit, amounts to > full shadow buffers) onto mode authors instead of changing Emacs to balance > b-c-f with a-c-f 100% of the time instead of 99%? I think to really avoid the complexity for mode authors, b-c-f and a-c-f need to not only balance, but also to be consistent. At the moment, they are not that either -- they can signal different locations for a given change. Phil