lisp-indent-line and comment-region in emacs-lisp-mode menu

lisp-indent-line and comment-region in emacs-lisp-mode menu

[Dan Nicolaescu]

Wouldn't it be better if the emacs-lisp-mode menu used
indent-for-tab-command instead of lisp-indent-line and
comment-dwim instead of comment-region ? 
The former don't have key bindings, but the latter do, so the menus
do not help users learn the key bindings.

What about "Indent region"?  Currently TAB does when transient-mark-mode is on...

Re: lisp-indent-line and comment-region in emacs-lisp-mode menu

[Juri Linkov]

> Wouldn't it be better if the emacs-lisp-mode menu used
> indent-for-tab-command instead of lisp-indent-line and

Here is what I currently use:

(define-key emacs-lisp-mode-map [tab] 'my-lisp-indent-or-complete)
(defun my-lisp-indent-or-complete (&optional arg)
  "Complete Lisp symbol, or indent line or region.
If the character preceding point is symbol-constituent, then perform
completion on Lisp symbol preceding point using `lisp-complete-symbol'.
Otherwise, call `indent-for-tab-command' that indents line or region."
  (interactive "P")
  (if (and (not (and transient-mark-mode mark-active
                     (not (eq (region-beginning) (region-end)))))
           (memq (char-syntax (preceding-char)) (list ?w ?_))
           (not (bobp)))
      (lisp-complete-symbol)
    (indent-for-tab-command arg)))

and find this very useful.  Maybe something like this should be added
to emacs-lisp-mode and its menu?

-- 
Juri Linkov
http://www.jurta.org/emacs/

RE: lisp-indent-line and comment-region in emacs-lisp-mode menu

[Drew Adams]

> > Wouldn't it be better if the emacs-lisp-mode menu used
> > indent-for-tab-command instead of lisp-indent-line and
> 
> Here is what I currently use:
> 
> (define-key emacs-lisp-mode-map [tab] 'my-lisp-indent-or-complete)
> (defun my-lisp-indent-or-complete (&optional arg)
>   "Complete Lisp symbol, or indent line or region.
> If the character preceding point is symbol-constituent, then perform
> completion on Lisp symbol preceding point using 
> `lisp-complete-symbol'.
> Otherwise, call `indent-for-tab-command' that indents line or region."
>   (interactive "P")
>   (if (and (not (and transient-mark-mode mark-active
>                      (not (eq (region-beginning) (region-end)))))
>            (memq (char-syntax (preceding-char)) (list ?w ?_))
>            (not (bobp)))
>       (lisp-complete-symbol)
>     (indent-for-tab-command arg)))
> 
> and find this very useful.  Maybe something like this should be added
> to emacs-lisp-mode and its menu?

I don't care if you add it, but please don't bind it to TAB. I use TAB to do
`lisp-indent-line' (the default) always. I don't want to have to move the
cursor away from a symbol constituent, just to be able to indent the line.
The beauty of TAB is that it works no matter where the cursor is on a line.

If you want to have TAB sometimes not indent (e.g. `lisp-complete-symbol'),
please do it via `tab-always-indent' = nil.

Re: lisp-indent-line and comment-region in emacs-lisp-mode menu

[Juri Linkov]

> I don't care if you add it, but please don't bind it to TAB. I use TAB to do
> `lisp-indent-line' (the default) always.

This is not the default anymore.  TAB in emacs-lisp-mode now uses the
default TAB binding `indent-for-tab-command'.  That's why Dan raised
this question.  In Emacs 22, the Emacs-Lisp menu has the item:

    Indent Line (TAB)

Now in CVS it shows a menu item with non-default `lisp-indent-line' that
has no key binding.  I think it makes sense to replace it with the command
`indent-for-tab-command' that is bound to TAB.

-- 
Juri Linkov
http://www.jurta.org/emacs/

RE: lisp-indent-line and comment-region in emacs-lisp-mode menu

[Drew Adams]

> > I don't care if you add it, but please don't bind it to 
> > TAB. I use TAB to do `lisp-indent-line' (the default) always.
> 
> This is not the default anymore.  TAB in emacs-lisp-mode now uses the
> default TAB binding `indent-for-tab-command'.

I'm using Emacs 22, but `indent-for-tab-command' still respects
`tab-always-indent' in Emacs 23, no?

> That's why Dan raised this question. In Emacs 22, the Emacs-Lisp
> menu has the item: Indent Line (TAB)
> 
> Now in CVS it shows a menu item with non-default 
> `lisp-indent-line' that  has no key binding.  I think it makes
> sense to replace it with the command `indent-for-tab-command'
> that is bound to TAB.

I have no problem with the menu reflecting the default binding, and I didn't
object to Dan's suggestion. 

I objected to your proposal to do something like the code you sent, *if* you
also intend to bind that to TAB. IIUC, your code does not respect
`tab-always-indent' - it simply completes a symbol if there is no active
region and the preceding char is a symbol or word constituent. I don't want
such behavior to be the default. 

Re: lisp-indent-line and comment-region in emacs-lisp-mode menu

[Dan Nicolaescu]

Juri Linkov <juri@jurta.org> writes:

  > > Wouldn't it be better if the emacs-lisp-mode menu used
  > > indent-for-tab-command instead of lisp-indent-line and
  > 
  > Here is what I currently use:
  > 
  > (define-key emacs-lisp-mode-map [tab] 'my-lisp-indent-or-complete)
  > (defun my-lisp-indent-or-complete (&optional arg)
  >   "Complete Lisp symbol, or indent line or region.
  > If the character preceding point is symbol-constituent, then perform
  > completion on Lisp symbol preceding point using `lisp-complete-symbol'.
  > Otherwise, call `indent-for-tab-command' that indents line or region."
  >   (interactive "P")
  >   (if (and (not (and transient-mark-mode mark-active
  >                      (not (eq (region-beginning) (region-end)))))
  >            (memq (char-syntax (preceding-char)) (list ?w ?_))
  >            (not (bobp)))
  >       (lisp-complete-symbol)
  >     (indent-for-tab-command arg)))
  > 
  > and find this very useful.  Maybe something like this should be added
  > to emacs-lisp-mode and its menu?

Maybe, but let's go one step at a time, first use for menus a command
that is also bound to a key.  And after that, discuss changing the key
bindings.  The former should be easy, it's mostly a bug fix.  The later
might be controversial.

Re: lisp-indent-line and comment-region in emacs-lisp-mode menu

[Juri Linkov]

> Wouldn't it be better if the emacs-lisp-mode menu used
> indent-for-tab-command instead of lisp-indent-line and
> comment-dwim instead of comment-region ?
> The former don't have key bindings, but the latter do, so the menus
> do not help users learn the key bindings.

If comment-dwim does the same that comment-region does
when transient-mark-mode is on by default then I think
comment-region could be replaced with comment-dwim.

> What about "Indent region"?  Currently TAB does when
> transient-mark-mode is on...

"Indent region" would be useless when transient-mark-mode is on.
But perhaps we should keep it for users who has the habit of using it.

-- 
Juri Linkov
http://www.jurta.org/emacs/

Re: lisp-indent-line and comment-region in emacs-lisp-mode menu

[Stefan Monnier]

> Wouldn't it be better if the emacs-lisp-mode menu used
> indent-for-tab-command instead of lisp-indent-line and
> comment-dwim instead of comment-region ?

For indent-line, it might be OK, although it suffers from the problem
that indent-for-tab-command doesn't necessarily indent the current line.
For comment-region, the problem is worse because as long as
transient-mark-mode is off, comment-dwim does not do comment-region.

Those DWIMish bindings (TAB, M-;) are problematic in this situation
because the menu entry text cannot faithfully describe the behavior.

> The former don't have key bindings, but the latter do, so the menus
> do not help users learn the key bindings.

Indeed.

> What about "Indent region"?  Currently TAB does when
> transient-mark-mode is on...

So are you suggesting to put TAB on both "indent line" and "indent
region"?


        Stefan

Re: lisp-indent-line and comment-region in emacs-lisp-mode menu

[Dan Nicolaescu]

Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> writes:

  > > Wouldn't it be better if the emacs-lisp-mode menu used
  > > indent-for-tab-command instead of lisp-indent-line and
  > > comment-dwim instead of comment-region ?
  > 
  > For indent-line, it might be OK, although it suffers from the problem
  > that indent-for-tab-command doesn't necessarily indent the current line.

Them maybe the solution is not to have a menu called "Indent Line".  If
we don't provide a key binding for such a thing, then we shouldn't
bother with a menu binding for it.  What would be a better name for the
menu entry?


  > For comment-region, the problem is worse because as long as
  > transient-mark-mode is off, comment-dwim does not do comment-region.

Would making the menu depend on transient-mark-mode be an option?
Any better ideas?

  > Those DWIMish bindings (TAB, M-;) are problematic in this situation
  > because the menu entry text cannot faithfully describe the behavior.


  > > The former don't have key bindings, but the latter do, so the menus
  > > do not help users learn the key bindings.
  > 
  > Indeed.
  > 
  > > What about "Indent region"?  Currently TAB does when
  > > transient-mark-mode is on...
  > 
  > So are you suggesting to put TAB on both "indent line" and "indent
  > region"?

That might be a good idea for the transient-mark-mode: show the users
that the only key binding they need to know for indenting is TAB.