From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: no-spam@cua.dk (Kim F. Storm) Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs learning curve Date: Sat, 24 Jul 2010 13:52:05 +0200 Message-ID: <877hkl14ii.fsf@kfs-lx.rd.rdm> References: <4C3B6A8A.80105@gmx.de> <87wrt0e81n.fsf@telefonica.net> <62E9699C07054418AB66F9C5FCB54E5C@us.oracle.com> <87sk3oe3la.fsf@telefonica.net> <1154D96E7D2F401D849266F359E44BB9@us.oracle.com> <87ocecdzou.fsf@telefonica.net> <2256C17F740A425884AD551DE7758056@us.oracle.com> <87fwzodqqm.fsf@telefonica.net> <5138CDF30B2D4B778F948015614DA7BC@us.oracle.com> <87iq4ijtdy.fsf@lola.goethe.zz> <87bpa7uu1e.fsf@kanis.fr> <87hbjr9x71.fsf@lola.goethe.zz> <87d3uf9vb2.fsf@lola.goethe.zz> <87wrsmully.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <87fwz9v5wn.fsf@catnip.gol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1279972510 25204 80.91.229.12 (24 Jul 2010 11:55:10 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 24 Jul 2010 11:55:10 +0000 (UTC) Cc: David Kastrup , Lennart Borgman , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Miles Bader Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Jul 24 13:55:07 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OcdJq-0007p3-WD for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 24 Jul 2010 13:55:07 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:59418 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OcdJq-0007OU-D8 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 24 Jul 2010 07:55:06 -0400 Original-Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=47977 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OcdJi-0007LX-7l for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 24 Jul 2010 07:54:59 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OcdJW-0003wU-Id for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 24 Jul 2010 07:54:47 -0400 Original-Received: from smtp.fullrate.dk ([90.185.1.42]:65254) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OcdH5-0003XO-Q7; Sat, 24 Jul 2010 07:52:15 -0400 Original-Received: from kfs-lx.rd.rdm.cua.dk (3008ds4-amb.0.fullrate.dk [90.184.173.162]) by smtp.fullrate.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id B87B59CE7D; Sat, 24 Jul 2010 13:52:06 +0200 (CEST) In-Reply-To: <87fwz9v5wn.fsf@catnip.gol.com> (Miles Bader's message of "Sat, 24 Jul 2010 13:51:36 +0900") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.1 (gnu/linux) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:127743 Archived-At: Miles Bader writes: > I don't have any religious objection to CUA keys (well at least the > C-x/C-c/C-v triumvirate), if there were a practical way of accommodating > them without excessive problems -- but thus far, despite all the > vigorous hand-waving and pontificating, nobody has actually come up with > anything that seems remotely practical. I have stayed out of this discussion so far ... as the topic seemed to about enabling CUA by default or not - I have no opinion about that -- having it as an easy to find option on the menus is good enough for me. However, I do take offence from your statement about CUA not being "remotely practical". Do you actually use CUA mode to a degree where you have practical experience to backup that statement -- or on what facts do you base your evaluation of the practical usefulness of CUA? I have used it for many years now (no surprise), and yes, it does stumble on me a few times each year -- as it to be expected - but it is nowhere near being impractical. For every day work -- it just works! To me, CUA bindings in emacs is about being able to easyly cut and paste BETWEEN applications. If you live your entire life inside Emacs, then CUA binding has no merit on its own. When you have to interact with other applications, being able to use the same keys for cut and paste is invaluable IMO - and far outweighs the tiny quirks you may experience with CUA mode from time to time. BTW, the major problem with enabling CUA bindings by default is NOT C-x and C-c (and the associated hacks), but that it "steals" the C-v binding permanently. At least you have to rewrite all the tutorials... -- Kim F. Storm http://www.cua.dk