Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode

Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode

[Angelo Graziosi]

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I use JetBrains Mono font in Emacs and in today build from master, the Org documents display a different ugly (in my opinion) font. See the fields 

#+language: 
#+options: toc:2 H:3 num:2 email:t
#+include:

#+begin_quote
#+end_quote

in test.org-emacs29-01oct2021.png attached.

With the build I did a month ago *all* is rendered with the same font, just the color changes. See the attached test.org-emacs28-02sep2021.png.

If this is not a bug, How can I restore the previous behavior?

In my init file I have:

(set-frame-font "JetBrains Mono-11" nil t)

(setq default-frame-alist
      '(
        (width . 115) ; character
        (height . 49) ; lines
        ;;(fullscreen . fullheight)
        ;;(left . (- 0)); pixel
        ;;(top  . (+ 0)); pixel
        (left . 840); pixel
        (top  .   0); pixel
        (font . "JetBrains Mono-11") ; font
        ))


Ciao,
 Angelo.

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Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode

[Protesilaos Stavrou]

On 2021-10-01, 23:40 +0200, Angelo Graziosi <angelo.g0@libero.it> wrote:

> I use JetBrains Mono font in Emacs and in today build from master, the
> Org documents display a different ugly (in my opinion) font. See the
> fields
>
> #+language: 
> #+options: toc:2 H:3 num:2 email:t
> #+include:
>
> #+begin_quote
> #+end_quote
>
> in test.org-emacs29-01oct2021.png attached.
>
> With the build I did a month ago *all* is rendered with the same font,
> just the color changes. See the attached
> test.org-emacs28-02sep2021.png.
>
> If this is not a bug, How can I restore the previous behavior?
>
> In my init file I have:
>
> (set-frame-font "JetBrains Mono-11" nil t)
>
> (setq default-frame-alist
>       '(
>         (width . 115) ; character
>         (height . 49) ; lines
>         ;;(fullscreen . fullheight)
>         ;;(left . (- 0)); pixel
>         ;;(top  . (+ 0)); pixel
>         (left . 840); pixel
>         (top  .   0); pixel
>         (font . "JetBrains Mono-11") ; font
>         ))

Hello Angelo,

This must be because in Org 9.5 those constructs inherit from the
'variable-pitch' face.  The idea behind that is to make the buffer
preserve spacing sensitive elements while using M-x variable-pitch-mode.

Please try using something like this:

    (set-face-attribute 'fixed-pitch nil
                        :family (face-attribute 'default :family)
                        :height (face-attribute 'default :height))

All the best,
Protesilaos

-- 
Protesilaos Stavrou
https://protesilaos.com

Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode

[Angelo Graziosi]

> Il 02/10/2021 06:47 Protesilaos Stavrou ha scritto:
> 
>  
> On 2021-10-01, 23:40 +0200, Angelo Graziosi <angelo.g0@libero.it> wrote:
> 
> > I use JetBrains Mono font in Emacs and in today build from master, the
> > Org documents display a different ugly (in my opinion) font. See the
> > fields
> >
> > #+language: 
> > #+options: toc:2 H:3 num:2 email:t
> > #+include:
> >
> > #+begin_quote
> > #+end_quote
> >
> > in test.org-emacs29-01oct2021.png attached.
> >
> > With the build I did a month ago *all* is rendered with the same font,
> > just the color changes. See the attached
> > test.org-emacs28-02sep2021.png.
> >
> > If this is not a bug, How can I restore the previous behavior?
> >
> > In my init file I have:
> >
> > (set-frame-font "JetBrains Mono-11" nil t)
> >
> > (setq default-frame-alist
> >       '(
> >         (width . 115) ; character
> >         (height . 49) ; lines
> >         ;;(fullscreen . fullheight)
> >         ;;(left . (- 0)); pixel
> >         ;;(top  . (+ 0)); pixel
> >         (left . 840); pixel
> >         (top  .   0); pixel
> >         (font . "JetBrains Mono-11") ; font
> >         ))
> 
> Hello Angelo,
> 
> This must be because in Org 9.5 those constructs inherit from the
> 'variable-pitch' face.  The idea behind that is to make the buffer
> preserve spacing sensitive elements while using M-x variable-pitch-mode.
> 
> Please try using something like this:
> 
>     (set-face-attribute 'fixed-pitch nil
>                         :family (face-attribute 'default :family)
>                         :height (face-attribute 'default :height))
> 

Thanks, that seems to work!

Ciao, 
  Angelo.

Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]

[Angelo Graziosi]

> Il 02/10/2021 06:47 Protesilaos Stavrou ha scritto:
> 
>  
> On 2021-10-01, 23:40 +0200, Angelo Graziosi wrote:
> 
> > I use JetBrains Mono font in Emacs and in today build from master, the
> > Org documents display a different ugly (in my opinion) font. See the
> > fields
> >
> > #+language: 
> > #+options: toc:2 H:3 num:2 email:t
> > #+include:
> >
> > #+begin_quote
> > #+end_quote
> >
> > in test.org-emacs29-01oct2021.png attached.
> >
> > With the build I did a month ago *all* is rendered with the same font,
> > just the color changes. See the attached
> > test.org-emacs28-02sep2021.png.
> >
> > If this is not a bug, How can I restore the previous behavior?
> >
> > In my init file I have:
> >
> > (set-frame-font "JetBrains Mono-11" nil t)
> >
> > (setq default-frame-alist
> >       '(
> >         (width . 115) ; character
> >         (height . 49) ; lines
> >         ;;(fullscreen . fullheight)
> >         ;;(left . (- 0)); pixel
> >         ;;(top  . (+ 0)); pixel
> >         (left . 840); pixel
> >         (top  .   0); pixel
> >         (font . "JetBrains Mono-11") ; font
> >         ))
> 
> Hello Angelo,
> 
> This must be because in Org 9.5 those constructs inherit from the
> 'variable-pitch' face.  The idea behind that is to make the buffer
> preserve spacing sensitive elements while using M-x variable-pitch-mode.
> 
> Please try using something like this:
> 
>     (set-face-attribute 'fixed-pitch nil
>                         :family (face-attribute 'default :family)
>                         :height (face-attribute 'default :height))
> 

Just for completeness,

It seems I need those settings only on Windows (10 pro 64) and macOS (10.13.6) because on GNU/Linux (with Monospaced font) I do not see the issue: those fields ("#+language:", "#+options:" etc.) are rendered with the same font! On Windows and macOS, instead, they are rendered differently (and ugly!).. On Windows I tried other fonts (Lucida Console, Cascadia Code) but with the same ugly results. On macOS the font is 'Monaco'.

Ciao,
  Angelo.

Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]

[Protesilaos Stavrou]

On 2021-10-04, 21:11 +0200, Angelo Graziosi <angelo.g0@libero.it> wrote:

>> Il 02/10/2021 06:47 Protesilaos Stavrou ha scritto:
>> 
>>  
>> On 2021-10-01, 23:40 +0200, Angelo Graziosi wrote:
>> 
>> > I use JetBrains Mono font in Emacs and in today build from master, the
>> > Org documents display a different ugly (in my opinion) font. See the
>> > fields
>
> [... 34 lines elided]
>
>> This must be because in Org 9.5 those constructs inherit from the
>> 'variable-pitch' face.  The idea behind that is to make the buffer
>> preserve spacing sensitive elements while using M-x variable-pitch-mode.
>> 
>> Please try using something like this:
>> 
>>     (set-face-attribute 'fixed-pitch nil
>>                         :family (face-attribute 'default :family)
>>                         :height (face-attribute 'default :height))
>> 
>
> Just for completeness,
>
> It seems I need those settings only on Windows (10 pro 64) and macOS
> (10.13.6) because on GNU/Linux (with Monospaced font) I do not see the
> issue: those fields ("#+language:", "#+options:" etc.) are rendered
> with the same font! On Windows and macOS, instead, they are rendered
> differently (and ugly!).. On Windows I tried other fonts (Lucida
> Console, Cascadia Code) but with the same ugly results. On macOS the
> font is 'Monaco'.

That may then be due to the default definition of the 'fixed-pitch'
face, which does not find a decent fallback font on all platforms.
Perhaps something like the following specification would be better, but
I have no means of testing it and do not know what the default/generic
monospaced fonts are on other platforms:

    (defface fixed-pitch
      '((((type w32))
         :family "What is the default on MS-Windows?")
        (((type ns))
         :family "What is the default on GNUstep or Macintosh Cocoa?")
        (t :family "Monospace"))
      "The basic fixed-pitch face."
      :group 'basic-faces)

The diff, for those interested:

     lisp/faces.el | 6 +++++-
     1 file changed, 5 insertions(+), 1 deletion(-)

    diff --git a/lisp/faces.el b/lisp/faces.el
    index 7b96d938c5..f1644add12 100644
    --- a/lisp/faces.el
    +++ b/lisp/faces.el
    @@ -2357,7 +2357,11 @@ (defface underline
       :group 'basic-faces)

     (defface fixed-pitch
    -  '((t :family "Monospace"))
    +  '((((type w32))
    +     :family "What is the default on MS-Windows?")
    +    (((type ns))
    +     :family "What is the default on GNUstep or Macintosh Cocoa?")
    +    (t :family "Monospace"))
       "The basic fixed-pitch face."
       :group 'basic-faces)
 
All the best,
Protesilaos

-- 
Protesilaos Stavrou
https://protesilaos.com

Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Protesilaos Stavrou <info@protesilaos.com>
> Date: Mon, 04 Oct 2021 22:40:55 +0300
> 
> On 2021-10-04, 21:11 +0200, Angelo Graziosi <angelo.g0@libero.it> wrote:
> 
> >> Il 02/10/2021 06:47 Protesilaos Stavrou ha scritto:
> >> 
> >>  
> >> On 2021-10-01, 23:40 +0200, Angelo Graziosi wrote:
> >> 
> >> > I use JetBrains Mono font in Emacs and in today build from master, the
> >> > Org documents display a different ugly (in my opinion) font. See the
> >> > fields
> >
> > [... 34 lines elided]
> >
> >> This must be because in Org 9.5 those constructs inherit from the
> >> 'variable-pitch' face.  The idea behind that is to make the buffer
> >> preserve spacing sensitive elements while using M-x variable-pitch-mode.
> >> 
> >> Please try using something like this:
> >> 
> >>     (set-face-attribute 'fixed-pitch nil
> >>                         :family (face-attribute 'default :family)
> >>                         :height (face-attribute 'default :height))
> >> 
> >
> > Just for completeness,
> >
> > It seems I need those settings only on Windows (10 pro 64) and macOS
> > (10.13.6) because on GNU/Linux (with Monospaced font) I do not see the
> > issue: those fields ("#+language:", "#+options:" etc.) are rendered
> > with the same font! On Windows and macOS, instead, they are rendered
> > differently (and ugly!).. On Windows I tried other fonts (Lucida
> > Console, Cascadia Code) but with the same ugly results. On macOS the
> > font is 'Monaco'.
> 
> That may then be due to the default definition of the 'fixed-pitch'
> face, which does not find a decent fallback font on all platforms.
> Perhaps something like the following specification would be better, but
> I have no means of testing it and do not know what the default/generic
> monospaced fonts are on other platforms:
> 
>     (defface fixed-pitch
>       '((((type w32))
>          :family "What is the default on MS-Windows?")
>         (((type ns))
>          :family "What is the default on GNUstep or Macintosh Cocoa?")
>         (t :family "Monospace"))
>       "The basic fixed-pitch face."
>       :group 'basic-faces)

I'd like to understand the problem better before we consider solutions
in this area.  What's the problem with "Monospace" on MS-Windows?
which font does that actually use?  ("C-u C-x =" on the text in
question should report the font Emacs uses to display that text.)

In general, "Monospace" is supposed to be different from the default
face's font, so "What is the default on MS-Windows" doesn't
necessarily have a useful answer for this purpose.

Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]

[Angelo Graziosi]

> Il 05/10/2021 13:47 Eli Zaretskii ha scritto:
> 
>  
> > From: Protesilaos Stavrou 
> > Date: Mon, 04 Oct 2021 22:40:55 +0300
> > 
> > On 2021-10-04, 21:11 +0200, Angelo Graziosi  wrote:
> > 
> > >> Il 02/10/2021 06:47 Protesilaos Stavrou ha scritto:
> > >> 
> > >>  
> > >> On 2021-10-01, 23:40 +0200, Angelo Graziosi wrote:
> > >> 
> > >> > I use JetBrains Mono font in Emacs and in today build from master, the

> > >> Please try using something like this:
> > >> 
> > >>     (set-face-attribute 'fixed-pitch nil
> > >>                         :family (face-attribute 'default :family)
> > >>                         :height (face-attribute 'default :height))
> > >> 

> I'd like to understand the problem better before we consider solutions
> in this area.  What's the problem with "Monospace" on MS-Windows?
> which font does that actually use?  ("C-u C-x =" on the text in
> question should report the font Emacs uses to display that text.)

When I do not use the above Protesilaos suggestions in the init, "C-u C-x =" on "begin_quote", for example, prints:

             position: 1613 of 4924 (33%), column: 5
            character: i (displayed as i) (codepoint 105, #o151, #x69)
              charset: ascii (ASCII (ISO646 IRV))
code point in charset: 0x69
               script: latin
               syntax: w 	which means: word
             category: .:Base, L:Left-to-right (strong), a:ASCII, l:Latin, r:Roman
             to input: type "C-x 8 RET 69" or "C-x 8 RET LATIN SMALL LETTER I"
          buffer code: #x69
            file code: #x69 (encoded by coding system utf-8-unix)
              display: by this font (glyph code):
    gdi:-raster-Courier-normal-normal-normal-mono-16-*-*-*-c-*-iso8859-1 (#x69)

Character code properties: customize what to show
  name: LATIN SMALL LETTER I
  general-category: Ll (Letter, Lowercase)
  decomposition: (105) ('i')

There is an overlay here:
 From 1608 to 1622
  face                 hl-line
  priority             -50
  window               nil

There are text properties here:
  face                 org-block-begin-line
  font-lock-fontified  t
  font-lock-multiline  t
  fontified            t


i.e., it uses Courier NOT JetBrains. On macOS something similar occurs: it uses Courier non Monaco. Instead on GNU/Linux (default font Monospace regular 11):

[...]
display: by this font (glyph code):
    ftcrhb:-PfEd-DejaVu Sans Mono-normal-normal-normal-*-15-*-*-*-m-0-iso10646-1 (#x4C)
[...]

> In general, "Monospace" is supposed to be different from the default
> face's font, so "What is the default on MS-Windows" doesn't
> necessarily have a useful answer for this purpose.

Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]

[Eli Zaretskii]

> Date: Tue, 5 Oct 2021 15:41:15 +0200 (CEST)
> From: Angelo Graziosi <angelo.g0@libero.it>
> Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
> 
> > > >> > I use JetBrains Mono font in Emacs and in today build from master, the
> 
> > > >> Please try using something like this:
> > > >> 
> > > >>     (set-face-attribute 'fixed-pitch nil
> > > >>                         :family (face-attribute 'default :family)
> > > >>                         :height (face-attribute 'default :height))
> > > >> 
> 
> > I'd like to understand the problem better before we consider solutions
> > in this area.  What's the problem with "Monospace" on MS-Windows?
> > which font does that actually use?  ("C-u C-x =" on the text in
> > question should report the font Emacs uses to display that text.)
> 
> When I do not use the above Protesilaos suggestions in the init, "C-u C-x =" on "begin_quote", for example, prints:
> 
>              position: 1613 of 4924 (33%), column: 5
>             character: i (displayed as i) (codepoint 105, #o151, #x69)
>               charset: ascii (ASCII (ISO646 IRV))
> code point in charset: 0x69
>                script: latin
>                syntax: w 	which means: word
>              category: .:Base, L:Left-to-right (strong), a:ASCII, l:Latin, r:Roman
>              to input: type "C-x 8 RET 69" or "C-x 8 RET LATIN SMALL LETTER I"
>           buffer code: #x69
>             file code: #x69 (encoded by coding system utf-8-unix)
>               display: by this font (glyph code):
>     gdi:-raster-Courier-normal-normal-normal-mono-16-*-*-*-c-*-iso8859-1 (#x69)

But if JetBrains is the font of the default face, then having Courier
for a non-default face is expected, and even desired.  So I'm not sure
I understand your complaint.  Did you expect the fixed-pitch face to
have the same font as the default face?  If so, it's a wrong
expectation: we deliberately defined the fixed-pitch face to have a
different typeface, so that it stands out.

> i.e., it uses Courier NOT JetBrains. On macOS something similar occurs: it uses Courier non Monaco. Instead on GNU/Linux (default font Monospace regular 11):
> 
> [...]
> display: by this font (glyph code):
>     ftcrhb:-PfEd-DejaVu Sans Mono-normal-normal-normal-*-15-*-*-*-m-0-iso10646-1 (#x4C)
> [...]

And the default font on GNU/Linux is also DejaVu Sans Mono?

Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]

[Angelo Graziosi]

> Il 05/10/2021 17:46 Eli Zaretskii ha scritto:
> 
>  
> > Date: Tue, 5 Oct 2021 15:41:15 +0200 (CEST)
> > From: Angelo Graziosi
> > Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
> > 
> > > > >> > I use JetBrains Mono font in Emacs and in today build from master, the
> > 
> > > > >> Please try using something like this:
> > > > >> 
> > > > >>     (set-face-attribute 'fixed-pitch nil
> > > > >>                         :family (face-attribute 'default :family)
> > > > >>                         :height (face-attribute 'default :height))
> > > > >> 
> > 
> > > I'd like to understand the problem better before we consider solutions
> > > in this area.  What's the problem with "Monospace" on MS-Windows?
> > > which font does that actually use?  ("C-u C-x =" on the text in
> > > question should report the font Emacs uses to display that text.)
> > 
> > When I do not use the above Protesilaos suggestions in the init, "C-u C-x =" on "begin_quote", for example, prints:
> > 
> >              position: 1613 of 4924 (33%), column: 5
> >             character: i (displayed as i) (codepoint 105, #o151, #x69)
> >               charset: ascii (ASCII (ISO646 IRV))
> > code point in charset: 0x69
> >                script: latin
> >                syntax: w 	which means: word
> >              category: .:Base, L:Left-to-right (strong), a:ASCII, l:Latin, r:Roman
> >              to input: type "C-x 8 RET 69" or "C-x 8 RET LATIN SMALL LETTER I"
> >           buffer code: #x69
> >             file code: #x69 (encoded by coding system utf-8-unix)
> >               display: by this font (glyph code):
> >     gdi:-raster-Courier-normal-normal-normal-mono-16-*-*-*-c-*-iso8859-1 (#x69)
> 
> But if JetBrains is the font of the default face, then having Courier
> for a non-default face is expected, and even desired.  So I'm not sure
> I understand your complaint.  Did you expect the fixed-pitch face to


Have you see the screenshots attached here: https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2021-10/msg00064.html?

In my opinion Courier is very ugly...


> have the same font as the default face?  If so, it's a wrong
> expectation: we deliberately defined the fixed-pitch face to have a
> different typeface, so that it stands out.

But Courier is ugly! If I remember, Courier is the default font on Windows and it is ugly! In the past, I tried Lucida Console (better than Courier) and Cascadia Code but even this has its own issues (https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2020-05/msg01950.html)


> 
> > i.e., it uses Courier NOT JetBrains. On macOS something similar occurs: it uses Courier non Monaco. Instead on GNU/Linux (default font Monospace regular 11):
> > 
> > [...]
> > display: by this font (glyph code):
> >     ftcrhb:-PfEd-DejaVu Sans Mono-normal-normal-normal-*-15-*-*-*-m-0-iso10646-1 (#x4C)
> > [...]
> 
> And the default font on GNU/Linux is also DejaVu Sans Mono?

Really Mint uses Monospace 10 and I configured Emacs adding this to the init:

(set-frame-font "Monospace-11" nil t)

(setq default-frame-alist
      '(
        (width . 115) ; character
        (height . 51) ; lines
        ;;(left . (- 0)); pixel
        ;;(top  . (+ 0)); pixel
        (left . 850); pixel
        (top  .   0); pixel
        (font . "Monospace-11") ; font
        ))

Monospace-10 is too small for my eyes!

Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]

[Eli Zaretskii]

> Date: Tue, 5 Oct 2021 21:45:02 +0200 (CEST)
> From: Angelo Graziosi <angelo.g0@libero.it>
> Cc: info@protesilaos.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org
> 
> Have you see the screenshots attached here: https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2021-10/msg00064.html?
> 
> In my opinion Courier is very ugly...

Well, "ugly" is a subjective opinion.  It's okay not to like it, but
it isn't necessarily a good reason to call for any changes in the
defaults.  (I'm aware that it wasn't you who suggested the change.)
Making fixed-pitch use the same font as the default font basically
does away with fixed-pitch as a distinct face.  That makes little
sense to me.  AFAIR, Courier was chosen to make sure the face will be
usable on all Windows versions.  We tried to use other alternative
fonts that are always present on Windows systems, but they all had
problems.

> > have the same font as the default face?  If so, it's a wrong
> > expectation: we deliberately defined the fixed-pitch face to have a
> > different typeface, so that it stands out.
> 
> But Courier is ugly! If I remember, Courier is the default font on Windows and it is ugly! In the past, I tried Lucida Console (better than Courier) and Cascadia Code but even this has its own issues (https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2020-05/msg01950.html)

Then maybe you should use fixed-pitch-serif face instead?

Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]

[Protesilaos Stavrou]

On 2021-10-06, 14:48 +0300, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wrote:

>> Date: Tue, 5 Oct 2021 21:45:02 +0200 (CEST)
>> From: Angelo Graziosi <angelo.g0@libero.it>
>> Cc: info@protesilaos.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org
>> 
>> Have you see the screenshots attached here: https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2021-10/msg00064.html?
>> 
>> In my opinion Courier is very ugly...
>
> Well, "ugly" is a subjective opinion.  It's okay not to like it, but
> it isn't necessarily a good reason to call for any changes in the
> defaults.  (I'm aware that it wasn't you who suggested the change.)
> Making fixed-pitch use the same font as the default font basically
> does away with fixed-pitch as a distinct face.  That makes little
> sense to me.  AFAIR, Courier was chosen to make sure the face will be
> usable on all Windows versions.  We tried to use other alternative
> fonts that are always present on Windows systems, but they all had
> problems.

On every GNU/Linux distro I have checked, the "Monospace" label is an
alias for a fallback font family controlled by the fontconfig library.
This usually ends up being "DejaVu Sans Mono".

Desktop Environments (e.g. Xfce) should be able to change the default
fonts through their settings.  Otherwise the user can set up fontconfig
rules directly.

I was the one who entertained the idea of a change to 'fixed-pitch',
though I wasn't aware that the "Monospace" font alias would work on
Windows/Mac.  Since it does, no change is required.  It is up to the
user to edit their system's default fonts.

For Emacs-specific configurations, it is possible to set the ':family'
attribute of the 'default', 'fixed-pitch', 'variable-pitch' faces, such
as in the example I shared in the original reply to this thread.

-- 
Protesilaos Stavrou
https://protesilaos.com

Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]

[Angelo Graziosi]

> Il 06/10/2021 13:48 Eli Zaretskii ha scritto:

> Well, "ugly" is a subjective opinion.  It's okay not to like it, but

No, it is ugly, use the right term. It is almost unreadable..

> it isn't necessarily a good reason to call for any changes in the
> defaults. 

I didn't request any changes, I flagged a potential issue writing

"If this is not a bug, How can I restore the previous behavior?"


> Then maybe you should use fixed-pitch-serif face instead?

What Protesilaos suggested seems to work and it is what I will use on Windows and macOS.

Thanks.

Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]

[Stefan Kangas]

Angelo Graziosi <angelo.g0@libero.it> writes:

> What Protesilaos suggested seems to work and it is what I will use on
> Windows and macOS.

It seems unfortunate if org-mode will suddenly come with a poorly
rendered font on a major platform, where IIUC we previously had
something that was at least okay.

Are the org-mode developers aware of this issue, and what do they have
to say about it?

Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]

[Protesilaos Stavrou]

On 2021-10-06, 17:40 -0400, Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@gmail.com> wrote:

> Angelo Graziosi <angelo.g0@libero.it> writes:
>
>> What Protesilaos suggested seems to work and it is what I will use on
>> Windows and macOS.
>
> It seems unfortunate if org-mode will suddenly come with a poorly
> rendered font on a major platform, where IIUC we previously had
> something that was at least okay.
>
> Are the org-mode developers aware of this issue, and what do they have
> to say about it?

This has been in Org 9.5 since commit 667cb6f1a on 2021-04-27.  I had
started the discussion about it in an email from 2020-09-09,[1] in which
I had attached a diff.  No one commented on it back then and, to my
knowledge, none has voiced an opinion about the change ever since.

That granted, I now think this is a bad default.  Such a feature should
be opt-in, otherwise it can catch users by surprise (as shown in this
discussion---also related is bug#46971 for which I sent a patch with
regard to the modus-themes).

Can Org be patched for emacs-28?  How does this work in terms of syncing
with org.git?  My suggestion would be to revert commit 667cb6f1a in
org.git, though I am not sure how to proceed.

What do you think?

[1] <https://list.orgmode.org/875z8njaol.fsf@protesilaos.com/>

-- 
Protesilaos Stavrou
https://protesilaos.com

Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]

[Ihor Radchenko]

Protesilaos Stavrou <info@protesilaos.com> writes:

> On 2021-10-06, 17:40 -0400, Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Angelo Graziosi <angelo.g0@libero.it> writes:
>>
>>> What Protesilaos suggested seems to work and it is what I will use on
>>> Windows and macOS.
>>
>> It seems unfortunate if org-mode will suddenly come with a poorly
>> rendered font on a major platform, where IIUC we previously had
>> something that was at least okay.
>>
>> Are the org-mode developers aware of this issue, and what do they have
>> to say about it?
>
> This has been in Org 9.5 since commit 667cb6f1a on 2021-04-27.  I had
> started the discussion about it in an email from 2020-09-09,[1] in which
> I had attached a diff.  No one commented on it back then and, to my
> knowledge, none has voiced an opinion about the change ever since.

Because your patch looked like an improvement ;)

> That granted, I now think this is a bad default.  Such a feature should
> be opt-in, otherwise it can catch users by surprise (as shown in this
> discussion---also related is bug#46971 for which I sent a patch with
> regard to the modus-themes).

> Can Org be patched for emacs-28?  How does this work in terms of syncing
> with org.git?  My suggestion would be to revert commit 667cb6f1a in
> org.git, though I am not sure how to proceed.

Given the raised concern, you can request reverting the patch in Org ML.
That should go to bugfix (=stable) branch. Then, Emacs devs can merge the latest
bugfix any time they prefer.

P.S. At least for tables, we also have an alternative solution for table
alignment in https://list.orgmode.org/8735uos5yj.fsf@localhost/

Best,
Ihor

Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]

[Protesilaos Stavrou]

On 2021-10-07, 12:57 +0800, Ihor Radchenko <yantar92@gmail.com> wrote:

>> That granted, I now think this is a bad default.  Such a feature should
>> be opt-in, otherwise it can catch users by surprise (as shown in this
>> discussion---also related is bug#46971 for which I sent a patch with
>> regard to the modus-themes).
>
>> Can Org be patched for emacs-28?  How does this work in terms of syncing
>> with org.git?  My suggestion would be to revert commit 667cb6f1a in
>> org.git, though I am not sure how to proceed.
>
> Given the raised concern, you can request reverting the patch in Org ML.
> That should go to bugfix (=stable) branch. Then, Emacs devs can merge the latest
> bugfix any time they prefer.

Thank you, Ihor!  If others have no objections or better ideas, I will
prepare that patch later today.

-- 
Protesilaos Stavrou
https://protesilaos.com

Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]

[Ihor Radchenko]

Protesilaos Stavrou <info@protesilaos.com> writes:

> On 2021-10-07, 12:57 +0800, Ihor Radchenko <yantar92@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>> That granted, I now think this is a bad default.  Such a feature should
>>> be opt-in, otherwise it can catch users by surprise (as shown in this
>>> discussion---also related is bug#46971 for which I sent a patch with
>>> regard to the modus-themes).
>>
>>> Can Org be patched for emacs-28?  How does this work in terms of syncing
>>> with org.git?  My suggestion would be to revert commit 667cb6f1a in
>>> org.git, though I am not sure how to proceed.
>>
>> Given the raised concern, you can request reverting the patch in Org ML.
>> That should go to bugfix (=stable) branch. Then, Emacs devs can merge the latest
>> bugfix any time they prefer.
>
> Thank you, Ihor!  If others have no objections or better ideas, I will
> prepare that patch later today.

I do not think that you need to prepare a separate patch. Reverting is
easy. I am forwarding this message to Org ML and CCing Nicolas.

Dear Orgers,

There have been issues [1] with recent fontification changes [2] on
Windows. Default fixed pitch font on Windows looks very bad and there is
no easy way to fix from Emacs. Prot is requesting to revert the patch.

[1] https://lists.gnu.org/r/emacs-devel/2021-10/msg00064.html
[2] https://list.orgmode.org/875z8njaol.fsf@protesilaos.com/

Best,
Ihor

Fwd: Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]

[Ihor Radchenko]

-------------------- Start of forwarded message --------------------
From: Ihor Radchenko <yantar92@gmail.com>
To: Protesilaos Stavrou <info@protesilaos.com>
Cc: Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@gmail.com>,  Angelo Graziosi
 <angelo.g0@libero.it>,  Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>,
  emacs-devel@gnu.org, emacs-org-mode@gnu.org, Nicolas Goaziou
 <mail@nicolasgoaziou.fr>
Subject: Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]
Date: Thu, 07 Oct 2021 13:24:21 +0800

Protesilaos Stavrou <info@protesilaos.com> writes:

> On 2021-10-07, 12:57 +0800, Ihor Radchenko <yantar92@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>> That granted, I now think this is a bad default.  Such a feature should
>>> be opt-in, otherwise it can catch users by surprise (as shown in this
>>> discussion---also related is bug#46971 for which I sent a patch with
>>> regard to the modus-themes).
>>
>>> Can Org be patched for emacs-28?  How does this work in terms of syncing
>>> with org.git?  My suggestion would be to revert commit 667cb6f1a in
>>> org.git, though I am not sure how to proceed.
>>
>> Given the raised concern, you can request reverting the patch in Org ML.
>> That should go to bugfix (=stable) branch. Then, Emacs devs can merge the latest
>> bugfix any time they prefer.
>
> Thank you, Ihor!  If others have no objections or better ideas, I will
> prepare that patch later today.

I do not think that you need to prepare a separate patch. Reverting is
easy. I am forwarding this message to Org ML and CCing Nicolas.

Dear Orgers,

There have been issues [1] with recent fontification changes [2] on
Windows. Default fixed pitch font on Windows looks very bad and there is
no easy way to fix from Emacs. Prot is requesting to revert the patch.

[1] https://lists.gnu.org/r/emacs-devel/2021-10/msg00064.html
[2] https://list.orgmode.org/875z8njaol.fsf@protesilaos.com/

Best,
Ihor
-------------------- End of forwarded message --------------------

Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]

[Eli Zaretskii]

> Date: Wed, 6 Oct 2021 23:06:45 +0200 (CEST)
> From: Angelo Graziosi <angelo.g0@libero.it>
> Cc: info@protesilaos.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org
> 
> > it isn't necessarily a good reason to call for any changes in the
> > defaults. 
> 
> I didn't request any changes

Protesilaos did, and I was alluding to that.

Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Protesilaos Stavrou <info@protesilaos.com>
> Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
> Date: Thu, 07 Oct 2021 07:27:32 +0300
> 
> On 2021-10-06, 17:40 -0400, Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Can Org be patched for emacs-28?

Yes, bugs in Org can be fixed on the emacs-28 branch.

> How does this work in terms of syncing with org.git?  My suggestion
> would be to revert commit 667cb6f1a in org.git, though I am not sure
> how to proceed.

You need to ask the Org developers to make that change, and then to
sync Org with what we have in the emacs-28 branch.  they do it
regularly for any bugfixes they consider to become part of Org 9.5.1
which will be the version included in Emacs 28.1.

Thanks.

Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Ihor Radchenko <yantar92@gmail.com>
> Cc: Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@gmail.com>,  Angelo Graziosi
>  <angelo.g0@libero.it>,  Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>,  emacs-devel@gnu.org
> Date: Thu, 07 Oct 2021 12:57:07 +0800
> 
> Given the raised concern, you can request reverting the patch in Org ML.
> That should go to bugfix (=stable) branch. Then, Emacs devs can merge the latest
> bugfix any time they prefer.

Minor correction: the merge of changes from Org to Emacs is handled by
the Org developers.

Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]

[Ihor Radchenko]

Protesilaos Stavrou <info@protesilaos.com> writes:

>> Given the raised concern, you can request reverting the patch in Org ML.
>> That should go to bugfix (=stable) branch. Then, Emacs devs can merge the latest
>> bugfix any time they prefer.
>
> Thank you, Ihor!  If others have no objections or better ideas, I will
> prepare that patch later today.

Bastien has reverted the problematic commit in 8aff825682. The problem
should be fixed in Org 9.5.3

Best,
Ihor

Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]

[Bastien]

Hi all,

Ihor Radchenko <yantar92@gmail.com> writes:

> Protesilaos Stavrou <info@protesilaos.com> writes:
>
>>> Given the raised concern, you can request reverting the patch in Org ML.
>>> That should go to bugfix (=stable) branch. Then, Emacs devs can merge the latest
>>> bugfix any time they prefer.
>>
>> Thank you, Ihor!  If others have no objections or better ideas, I will
>> prepare that patch later today.
>
> Bastien has reverted the problematic commit in 8aff825682. The problem
> should be fixed in Org 9.5.3

Indeed - and Org 9.5.3 is now available on elpa.gnu.org.

Thanks Protesilaos for raising this and Ihor for the heads up!

From now on, the "bugfix" branch of org-mode will be more conservative
and receive only important bug fixes, until 9.5.4 is out and ready for
Emacs 28.2.  Minor bug fixes will go to the main branch, for Org 9.6.

Thanks,

-- 
 Bastien

Re: Fwd: Re: Emacs master: different (ugly) font in org-mode [Windows, macOS]

[Bastien]

Ihor Radchenko <yantar92@gmail.com> writes:

> I do not think that you need to prepare a separate patch. Reverting is
> easy.

Fixed by reverting in Org 9.5.3, thanks!

-- 
 Bastien