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From: Visuwesh <visuweshm@gmail.com>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>
Cc: yantar92@posteo.net,  pinmacs@cas.cat,  rpluim@gmail.com,
	emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: Re: yank-media: allow users to limit image types that can be inserted
Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2024 19:07:49 +0530	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <877c9s2vrm.fsf@gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <86iktd8o9h.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sun, 27 Oct 2024 19:11:06 +0200")

[ஞாயிறு அக்டோபர் 27, 2024] Eli Zaretskii wrote:

>> From: Visuwesh <visuweshm@gmail.com>
>> Cc: yantar92@posteo.net,  pinmacs@cas.cat,  rpluim@gmail.com,
>>   emacs-devel@gnu.org
>> Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2024 20:32:21 +0530
>> 
>> [ஞாயிறு அக்டோபர் 27, 2024] Eli Zaretskii wrote:
>> 
>> >> > Examine the available TARGETS, then bind
>> >> > yank-media--registered-handlers to the appropriate value when invoking
>> >> > yank-media.
>> >> 
>> >> Would that not defeat the point of yank-media, which is to present a
>> >> simple, common interface to the clipboard data to major-mode authors?
>> >
>> > Which part of the above would "defeat the point of yank-media", and
>> > why?
>> 
>> yank-media presents a uniform interface to clipboard data across
>> platforms, in principle.  This implies that there is no need to know the
>> ugly details of how the clipboard data is to be fetched, which data
>> types are available and which of them are bogus, etc.
>
> My suggestion does not require any need to know those ugly details.
> It just suggests to remove from the list the handlers a mode doesn't
> want.  Removing the, say, image/png handler from the list does not
> require any knowledge how that handler accesses the clipboard nor how
> it extracts PNG images from the clipboard.  It just requires to know
> the (trivial) fact that an image/png handler can interpret the
> clipboard data as a PNG image.
>
> So I don't think I understand your reasoning.  What did I miss?
>
>> The major-mode authors would simply write handlers for all relevant
>> data types and leave it to the user to choose the preferred type if
>> more than one of them is handled by the major-mode.
>
> AFAIU, we were talking about situations where the major mode "knows
> better" than the user, and doesn't want to leave the choice to users.
>
>> But if the major-mode authors have to cater to the user's preferred data
>> types by looking at TARGETS in their "major-mode-yank-media" command,
>> that defeats the abstraction yank-media provides...
>
> I don't understand how.  TARGETS include stuff like image/png and
> text/html; how does looking at that defeat any abstractions, and what
> abstractions are those?  We cannot consider TARGETS to be an opaque
> object anyway because then we won't be able to ask the user which of
> the MIME types she wants to yank, nor apply any advance preferences of
> the user.
>
>> The entire point of using the library, IMHO, is to leave out this
>> nasty business of handling the clipboard to a third party.
>
> What do you mean by "handling the clipboard"?  In my mind, "handling
> the clipboard" is what the handlers do, and my suggestion doesn't
> change that, nor does it require any knowledge about their works.  It
> only requires to know that each MIME type has a handler, and removing
> that handler from the list will prevent the clipboard data from being
> interpreted as that MIME type.
>
>> > If Org has its own ideas about what's best for the users in some
>> > situations, and if the users agree with that, I don't see what is
>> > wrong with that.  The common interface presented by yank-media to
>> > major modes is there so that major modes could use it in whichever
>> > ways they think is best for their users.  So I see no problems in
>> > major modes deciding to prefer some handlers over others, not in
>> > principle.
>> 
>> We do not disagree about this at all.  What we do disagree on is the
>> means by which to achieve this.  If we could specify a filter function
>> as a variable that filters out the available data types before
>> presenting it to the user, the major-mode authors would be saved the
>> burden of writing their yank-media-like command which requires the
>> knowledge of obtaining TARGETS and potentially ignoring bogus types in
>> it.
>
> How will that filter function be any different from what I propose?
> You want to filter MIME types, I suggest filtering the handler, but
> since each handler is uniquely identified by the MIME type it handles,
> what exactly is the big difference?
>
> I feel there's some gross misunderstanding here, but what is it?

I feel the same too.  I believe it would be more productive if I
proposed a patch of what I am suggesting so that things will be more
clear.  I will try to post one as soon as time permits, and will answer
rest of the questions you've raised in your message then.



  reply	other threads:[~2024-10-28 13:37 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 46+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2024-09-22 16:53 yank-media: allow users to limit image types that can be inserted pinmacs
2024-09-23 11:20 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-09-23 13:46   ` Visuwesh
2024-09-23 14:30     ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-09-23 15:06       ` Visuwesh
2024-09-23 15:48         ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-09-23 15:09       ` Robert Pluim
2024-09-23 15:14         ` Visuwesh
2024-09-23 15:20           ` Robert Pluim
2024-09-23 15:58           ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-09-24  5:00             ` Visuwesh
2024-09-24  5:10               ` Visuwesh
2024-09-24 11:57               ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-09-24 12:42                 ` Visuwesh
2024-09-23 15:54         ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-09-23 16:10           ` Robert Pluim
2024-09-23 16:34             ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-09-23 18:00               ` pinmacs
2024-09-23 18:35                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-09-23 20:45                   ` Pedro
2024-09-23 21:08                   ` pinmacs
2024-09-24  8:15                     ` Robert Pluim
2024-09-24 11:30                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-09-24 12:18                       ` Robert Pluim
2024-09-24 13:08                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-09-24 13:38                           ` Visuwesh
2024-09-24 13:50                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-09-24  5:08                   ` Visuwesh
2024-09-24 12:00                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-09-24 12:50                       ` Visuwesh
2024-09-24 13:23                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-09-24 13:37                           ` Visuwesh
2024-10-26 17:27                       ` Ihor Radchenko
2024-10-26 19:09                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-10-27  8:17                           ` Ihor Radchenko
2024-10-27  9:14                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-10-27  9:36                               ` Visuwesh
2024-10-27 10:09                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-10-27 15:02                                   ` Visuwesh
2024-10-27 17:11                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-10-28 13:37                                       ` Visuwesh [this message]
2024-10-29 11:29                                       ` Visuwesh
2024-10-28 18:39                               ` Ihor Radchenko
2024-10-28 18:50                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-09-23 18:11               ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-09-24  8:38                 ` Robert Pluim

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