From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Juri Linkov Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Emacs Info manuals (was: Guile in Emacs) Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2010 01:29:09 +0300 Organization: JURTA Message-ID: <87633rxc96.fsf_-_@mail.jurta.org> References: <4B8147A9.7030504@gmail.com> <873a0cyv3r.fsf@lola.goethe.zz> <87aauiho3y.fsf_-_@lifelogs.com> <1271028837.6164.55.camel@dell-desktop.example.com> <1271102739.6067.38.camel@dell-desktop.example.com> <8039yz34ka.fsf@tiny.isode.net> <1271173887.6067.53.camel@dell-desktop.example.com> <87FA5F05CB9C41409B9E72BD06D7C8CF@us.oracle.com> <87fx2xp839.fsf@lola.goethe.zz> <3EFDD45EB5AD4018B8FEA8F13CFEDA32@us.oracle.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1271457182 19384 80.91.229.12 (16 Apr 2010 22:33:02 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2010 22:33:02 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel To: Jeff Clough Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Apr 17 00:33:01 2010 connect(): No such file or directory Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1O2u5r-0005oS-JK for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 17 Apr 2010 00:32:59 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50987 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1O2u5q-0005ye-Ue for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 16 Apr 2010 18:32:58 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1O2u5l-0005yP-Bn for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 16 Apr 2010 18:32:53 -0400 Original-Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=52718 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1O2u5j-0005xo-3h for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 16 Apr 2010 18:32:52 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1O2u5h-0001SZ-Bx for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 16 Apr 2010 18:32:50 -0400 Original-Received: from smtp-out2.starman.ee ([85.253.0.4]:54824 helo=mx2.starman.ee) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1O2u5h-0001SM-1Y for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 16 Apr 2010 18:32:49 -0400 X-Virus-Scanned: by Amavisd-New at mx2.starman.ee Original-Received: from mail.starman.ee (82.131.70.170.cable.starman.ee [82.131.70.170]) by mx2.starman.ee (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16BEE3F4082; Sat, 17 Apr 2010 01:32:44 +0300 (EEST) In-Reply-To: (Jeff Clough's message of "Thu, 15 Apr 2010 09:54:02 -0400") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.0.50 (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6, seldom 2.4 (older, 4) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:123784 Archived-At: > 1. The Emacs Manual [...] > 2. The Emacs Lisp Intro [...] > 3. The Emacs Lisp Reference [...] > 4. The online documentation/what you get from describe-function and > it's kin - The definitive reference to every symbol you can throw at > Emacs. Assumed to be up-to-date and accurate. This is for people > knee-deep in code right now that can't remember what the third argument > of the function at point needs to be, or can't remember if what they > want is insert-file-contents or insert-file-contents-literally. I'd like to also clarify that the purpose of the fourth is not only to provide actual information about available functions and their arguments but also to add dynamical information like whether a function is advised, what keybindings it has, etc. IOW, this information can't be in a static Info file. So unlike 3 static Info manuals, the online help manual should be dynamically created at run time. This is possible to do using virtual Info manuals. > I think having cross references between the four sources described above > is a great thing. There should be more of that today. Yes, this would be a great thing, but unfortunately currently cross references between the online documentation and Info manuals are largely dysfunctional. However, with the online documentation in a virtual Info manual, cross references between these four sources will use the existing Info cross references, thus providing more consistent UI. -- Juri Linkov http://www.jurta.org/emacs/