From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Karl Fogel Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Unnecessarily moving stiff between files considered harmful Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2018 13:03:08 -0500 Message-ID: <87605macv7.fsf@red-bean.com> References: <20180311105533.30002.78782@vcs0.savannah.gnu.org> <20180311105534.3DAFD23CF3@vcs0.savannah.gnu.org> <83woyiscns.fsf@gnu.org> <87po44jb7w.fsf@red-bean.com> <20180311105533.30002.78782@vcs0.savannah.gnu.org> <20180311105534.3DAFD23CF3@vcs0.savannah.gnu.org> <83woyiscns.fsf@gnu.org> <87a7v2zb27.fsf@red-bean.com> <838tallwpg.fsf@gnu.org> <87a7v0brtb.fsf@red-bean.com> <837eq4k2dk.fsf@gnu.org> Reply-To: Karl Fogel NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1521828081 13489 195.159.176.226 (23 Mar 2018 18:01:21 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2018 18:01:21 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Mar 23 19:01:17 2018 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ezR08-0003Nj-Vg for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 23 Mar 2018 19:01:17 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:39237 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ezR2C-00082B-7m for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 23 Mar 2018 14:03:24 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:39285) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ezR22-00081d-IS for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 23 Mar 2018 14:03:19 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ezR1z-00040Z-TS for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 23 Mar 2018 14:03:14 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-ot0-x234.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4003:c0f::234]:43708) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ezR1z-0003zW-Oa; Fri, 23 Mar 2018 14:03:11 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-ot0-x234.google.com with SMTP id m22-v6so14175082otf.10; Fri, 23 Mar 2018 11:03:11 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=sender:from:to:cc:subject:references:reply-to:date:in-reply-to :message-id:user-agent:mime-version; bh=M1/O7eNzlW1gzDX1FT9Tc/4Nv5r3nSV7PuGsfW/GF+U=; b=aE1mXs0YQXEpwvhwRONXIw2EVLEp93ugAGC8GzzSXPqnZewrJ+yDpvO+lyJdyU3b4b fFaugmGCeAGj4twR/msj/blRePu8v/p/MoFn9gWySviUAEtkapncPeweJfJ50cWmKExx ViSkjwJduo3UaJk7x5hkNqs6YD+2ZbLBSJf6RBrrhK+bMSVZeMEs9PphHqB5Ng1qBlqu TyF8l4Zv+C/2dRm+7VFUnhM3fFdy/ghj1NBxC0iys64HNDtiTcg7UtGoVqJXI8F31fxl ASS+M2g2nGpwOEUOfLS+2bbsprpQyKw/ZOkrVwAZD8Eq9sNrqTeh+m2u9LehDsyV9RG0 EPOw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:sender:from:to:cc:subject:references:reply-to :date:in-reply-to:message-id:user-agent:mime-version; bh=M1/O7eNzlW1gzDX1FT9Tc/4Nv5r3nSV7PuGsfW/GF+U=; b=J7V+Jcga2Ez1UTyXJv849qHVjXF7r4h/UhMteLxs3XXMQgoUiLqzXK5X4jmmff2pWu aq7CoZxa+gLPHlIpZupOTBGFJIf1otdDkFZoK1OzwYiUPK7mLnUKZ1Xj1DFp6uZN/xkv s/lYSGAJ4ShDRv2YrUHRXqv0rgFRkFRxyWl7VN4Z2rAepgwJ/H2xGzwTtcSRY9BCDuqf EKpGwpwGmevcJ7yrf99B9LCu3PcC0piCtVaaMmHN01TPnnIwF8aKEbNLD9lGByU6o+/R yADVd3/goaCqUSX8hubL+7Z8q9dyuLCuDHWS1TrErSbk7yq+thfuAd3958XVPuB0GW/e wwag== X-Gm-Message-State: AElRT7ERV3hVWXOPzbv/XHdr94SFhphkRRCJB3W1IYg9YM7EIsgFvbBl mgjNcs+7PBIEh5GqS/A7nkiAMA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AG47ELv4AsPpPiwVICtb7VakVrUwwVrOIEaKH8YDjQ9K0waLQyOySi3aJoQIjyZsUZ5oHIhO74x2LA== X-Received: by 2002:a9d:510e:: with SMTP id c14-v6mr14861744oth.36.1521828190544; Fri, 23 Mar 2018 11:03:10 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from kwork (74-92-190-114-Illinois.hfc.comcastbusiness.net. [74.92.190.114]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id x138sm2809980oix.10.2018.03.23.11.03.09 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-CHACHA20-POLY1305 bits=256/256); Fri, 23 Mar 2018 11:03:09 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <837eq4k2dk.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Thu, 22 Mar 2018 09:15:03 +0200") X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 2607:f8b0:4003:c0f::234 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:223972 Archived-At: Eli Zaretskii writes: >Btw, if I'm allowed a gripe: we have too much of this in our history >already. Just recently I wanted to know when the assertion in >set_blv_found was born, and was unable to determine this using Git, >because that function was first a macro, then an inline function, and >migrated between 2 or 3 files several times. I eventually had to use >ChangeLog files from old Emacs releases(!) to find out the history of >this single line. I'm sure Git gurus will come up with some >convoluted way to do that with Git, and Magit gurus will tell that >Magit already knows how to do this. But the fact that the usual tools >of trade fail here is for me a clear indication that we should keep >this disadvantage in mind when making such changes: there's a non-zero >price here. I looked at places in CONTRIBUTE where it might work to add a sentence or two about this, but didn't see any good places to fit it in, hmm. I agree, there is a price. (In the case of particular change we were discussing, I thought the price was worth paying, but there are always going to be edge-case disagreements about the relative value of moving code vs the negative effects of the churn.)