From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: How to make Emacs popular again: Use monospaced fonts less Date: Mon, 12 Oct 2020 00:21:10 +0200 Message-ID: <875z7gflpl.fsf@gnus.org> References: <84273aa2-24a9-7584-18b9-03a5ac783d62@yandex.ru> <835z7vjrg3.fsf@gnu.org> <83tuvegkmo.fsf@gnu.org> <83v9ftf6n9.fsf@gnu.org> <835z7qfp6h.fsf@gnu.org> <87ft6lgw5y.fsf_-_@gnus.org> <1F8F3522-1E6C-40A3-B61A-B9B84FC0AD18@gnu.org> <87blh9gthg.fsf@gnus.org> <87tuv1f2y9.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8l9f1dl.fsf@gnus.org> <83lfgc50gb.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="10538"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Mon Oct 12 00:22:08 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kRjjD-0002dv-Nm for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 12 Oct 2020 00:22:07 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:48764 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kRjjC-0001Yl-Q0 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 11 Oct 2020 18:22:06 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:45046) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kRjiP-00019g-P4 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 11 Oct 2020 18:21:17 -0400 Original-Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([2a01:4f9:2b:f0f::2]:38676) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kRjiN-0007Wc-Tj; Sun, 11 Oct 2020 18:21:17 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=w+FylZCC81sZt7egOZRMGBICvrSUgPYRF4Ue8vWkrss=; b=aVuqj1RziYhTVPDyRgeNtZv7It NN6pEhfEwGytAQth7R78z5gZ4t7QC8DXvDgcVUZGEHQmSo92YmDhNZy67Kui/MR42uYiwEwQHHYTE WWImiUpejO0VOEBqCLQY9Dn2kFUd/r0PU/lBZNBeYKXa6jAofQm+ipcbHll3y2XwvtXg=; Original-Received: from cm-84.212.202.86.getinternet.no ([84.212.202.86] helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kRjiJ-0000lM-F3; Mon, 12 Oct 2020 00:21:14 +0200 Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAAD1BMVEUWCwtdNjSvSkG+ oJ////9WMgcnAAAAAWJLR0QEj2jZUQAAAAd0SU1FB+QKCxYLBVeFnhIAAAFXSURBVDjLtZPrsYQg DIUTbSDBBiBUIPTf2z3h5eroz5uZ3RnzwckTov8xfneLAsnLcU0qbyQE1ZfzpLCJtEsPv1VYOq9L HatZaUSnYE9Rg7mVWvSRUuok17hEekpq3XLBqSsQpwUqarnS3mwCqyeRxaU0QXAtrnUCs6O4PzWt LU/AUChTK8tWywqRB0DSObLH6SCjZrgjjuD/F1jNcImLWuIal5SdKF2FkR9Aliu4p6sWYjgt7iaz 7dYqr+hhvsAYhyjqAqqQ+gGMPAAKpuVzhLWRqh7+85QButEoVy3lDsSHN0Hy6wB+S/p8aLSCRRGb jtFY7jeEAolUdGKf3egAtXv9Z6BtDo+p9a7ZjuVVWrvTlNaCrf1wqTVg+tlMv3HfZFZfIBHy0De/ nsRBPHiQa/Pa4nLqUg8xHufs8VzWGt7dPt3b83j5eryHB5Av8HpDvsAX0Q+tP5gBNiqaP9laAAAA JXRFWHRkYXRlOmNyZWF0ZQAyMDIwLTEwLTExVDIyOjExOjA0KzAwOjAwGwTmbQAAACV0RVh0ZGF0 ZTptb2RpZnkAMjAyMC0xMC0xMVQyMjoxMTowNCswMDowMGpZXtEAAAAASUVORK5CYII= X-Now-Playing: Crack We Are Rock's _Cosmic Mind Flight_: "Colonial" In-Reply-To: <83lfgc50gb.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sun, 11 Oct 2020 16:58:12 +0300") Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a01:4f9:2b:f0f::2; envelope-from=larsi@gnus.org; helo=quimby.gnus.org X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: No matching host in p0f cache. That's all we know. X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:257421 Archived-At: Eli Zaretskii writes: >> This reminds me, by the way... I forget if this has been discussed >> before or not, but in these cases it'd be handy to have a text property >> like, say, (propertize "foo" :min-width 5) (or :min-width (50)), and >> have the display engine compute how much space to add to the end. >> >> Would that be much work to add? > > Let's put it this way: if there's a simple way of adding this, I > cannot think of it. Yeah, the semantics of text properties aren't very well-defined, either. I mean, if you have "foo" in the buffer with a :min-width (50) text property, and then you insert a space in the middle (without any properties), then both "fo" and "o" would have a separate :min-width (50) stretch, so presumably would both be that wide. So that's kinda a mess. > Btw, if there were such a property, how would you calculate the value > to put there? It depends -- for instance, when calculating tabular layouts, I'd know the number of pixels already. In the mode line, I'd take 5x typical-character-width if I wanted to display something that should typically not take more than 5 characters. Which is what we do in the mode line already for some of the things that change lengths, like the line numbers. OK, here's another random idea for padding variable-pitch elements in the mode lines in particular: (setq mode-line-thing `(:propertize "some-string" :min-width 15)) which could have well-defined semantics, like "this element should have the width of at least 15 typical characters", and be pretty easy to use? -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no