From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Robert Pluim Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: The FIXME in `dotimes' Date: Wed, 07 Sep 2022 16:29:42 +0200 Message-ID: <875yhzb6ll.fsf@gmail.com> References: <874jxjeb6i.fsf@posteo.net> <186D93BC-1654-4D3A-B9AC-03819DFDD6D9@acm.org> <87wnafjof6.fsf@posteo.net> <5F6C02DB-55F2-4AA2-8706-4BF38449AEAF@acm.org> <87o7vrnu65.fsf@posteo.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="1053"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Mattias =?utf-8?Q?Engdeg=C3=A5rd?= , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Philip Kaludercic Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Sep 07 16:30:58 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1oVw4v-000Abo-Fi for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 07 Sep 2022 16:30:57 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:52488 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oVw4t-0003VB-T1 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 07 Sep 2022 10:30:55 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:42356) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oVw3n-0002j8-Oy for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 07 Sep 2022 10:29:47 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-wr1-x42e.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::42e]:36587) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oVw3m-0007PV-7y for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 07 Sep 2022 10:29:47 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-wr1-x42e.google.com with SMTP id b17so7344681wrq.3 for ; Wed, 07 Sep 2022 07:29:45 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:message-id:date :gmane-reply-to-list:references:in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from:from :to:cc:subject:date; bh=xDBqpjPWknfpjOx175qyX0HfCOezzsXCtoE8HMSjyb8=; b=fEEgbXcbcaAK+2Dhwqf4ZUyFJFCHDDNj4/FZ/g++vVq9iGyuTMF1rd2OczKFt+jpOL nUvu4nEOTBKwo9nnrJhbZ2/zUWNnMuhPg2VPyoIlYe1pLmlR+Ie15Y7HkGy9HcNSE+08 lWDWESbEQI1Tej/paxKiSNHnANYXwNDStcFA25E/0pbbQy+/eCXp2QW9/wCMWbyCqwHc yH4z1b6pXdiOM7LzbE1vh0JpQ8X9lXPkD3hCesBtYdoZkLS3zjdeEqTP0Bm6ID8xbQvR E5afqFvw6yDlXyQzEFK2Ihv0xAQHLiGO6ogL7FTTJu9lpjFeMVQe6RiYhsxht3iTw0CN Y1Cw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:message-id:date :gmane-reply-to-list:references:in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from :x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date; bh=xDBqpjPWknfpjOx175qyX0HfCOezzsXCtoE8HMSjyb8=; b=Iqz6vMUY788oc34J1xQUcWDyB8JYcSUhDiRkuz/DtT/jI2XIWkOVOz8UKFgshSxVdR Id2p7+RGHeqUbZaW6NFGY9/RopkHr+Ve6jbzvVivjJy3vj0XcQk9+sUuxUgs62vy0WkK 2BwTLpB0HwzqyZCmeoEMlb6lIoM213mMeb+z+dWI1Clc0REp0xi2QkK+/TgdvGCf/CrC Dv1RtyDF7SyFCH10mtsSN77QLR+uc0jjVX8816V/qHNIDNrQ3kUMPyX+7JyZXfJ4S9TH Bzuq0kNEjvECf3KNNY7ADhcQGr4/GkoEOPddAhCcs4Nzmm9Sg9v3hbNyGSeWEJlZyolN fofQ== X-Gm-Message-State: ACgBeo2XghNjbafgNkeMbIOitf/aSyjyhl0LXjCSqS8JOExvXQn29Q4D XnryC2JWZ8Rxm/GiHCK50Qf4eE1hOFRO2A== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AA6agR69SXf7fm/qjWyKXBO2KwnrNPfjyDkvxyTcHYYZhLHtS6VEP8HBMU1U1FYjK1+BimLWMGyMPw== X-Received: by 2002:a05:6000:16ce:b0:228:62e0:37a6 with SMTP id h14-20020a05600016ce00b0022862e037a6mr2293141wrf.563.1662560983555; Wed, 07 Sep 2022 07:29:43 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from rltb ([2a01:e0a:3f3:fb50:1a83:d106:c1f4:476c]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id v64-20020a1cac43000000b003a844885f88sm20539369wme.22.2022.09.07.07.29.42 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Wed, 07 Sep 2022 07:29:43 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <87o7vrnu65.fsf@posteo.net> (Philip Kaludercic's message of "Wed, 07 Sep 2022 14:19:46 +0000") Gmane-Reply-To-List: yes Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::42e; envelope-from=rpluim@gmail.com; helo=mail-wr1-x42e.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:294845 Archived-At: >>>>> On Wed, 07 Sep 2022 14:19:46 +0000, Philip Kaludercic said: Philip> Mattias Engdeg=C3=A5rd writes: >> 7 sep. 2022 kl. 15.37 skrev Philip Kaludercic : >>=20 >>> (dotimes (count) ...) >>=20 >> Lisp syntax rarely make the first element optional, and in this case >> it's both the first and the last one: >>=20 >> (dotimes ([VAR] COUNT [RESULT]) BODY...) >>=20 >> which is a bit alien, and it's perhaps not worth the trouble for just >> omitting an underscore? >>=20 >>> (dotimes count ...) >>=20 >> That wouldn't allow for arbitrary expressions so it's of limited >> utility (and Lisp-alien, again). There's also the risk that someone >> will eventually replace a variable by a function call, turning >> (dotimes x ...) into (dotimes (f x) ...). Philip> I agree, the idea was not well thought out and not worth the Philip> complication. Surely the goal here should be to borrow a name from other languages, but have the result behave differently? (defmacro range (count &rest body) =F0=9F=98=9C Robert --=20