all messages for Emacs-related lists mirrored at yhetil.org
 help / color / mirror / code / Atom feed
From: David Kastrup <dak@gnu.org>
To: emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: Re: Unibyte characters, strings, and buffers
Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2014 18:16:39 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <8738i1orgo.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: 87a9c9aqhu.fsf@nbtrap.com

Nathan Trapuzzano <nbtrap@nbtrap.com> writes:

> "Stephen J. Turnbull" <stephen@xemacs.org> writes:
>
>> What is relevant is how to represent byte streams in Emacs.  The
>> obvious non-unibyte way is a one-to-one mapping of bytes to Unicode
>> characters.  It is *extremely* convenient if the first 128 of those
>> bytes correspond to the ASCII coded character set, because so many
>> wire protocols use ASCII "words" syntactically.  The other 128 don't
>> matter much, so why not just use the extremely convenient Latin-1 set
>> for them?
>
> Sorry if someone brought this up already, but one reason raw bytes
> shouldn't be represented as Latin-1 characters is that the "raw
> bytes"-ness would be lost when writing them back to disk if the stream
> also contained characters outside the Latin-1 range.

No.

> For example, say we decode a stream of raw bytes as utf8, but that the
> stream contains some non-utf8 sequences.  IIUC, Emacs will interpret
> those as "raw bytes", so that when it goes to encode the string to write
> it back, they will be written back verbatim.

"Raw bytes" here are represented as particular characters outside of the
Unicode range.  They are representable in multibyte buffers.  They never
were representable in unibyte buffers.  While it is conceivable to map
characters 128..255 in unibyte strings/buffers to the respective
character codes outside of the Unicode range, that would render
programmatic manipulation of bytes strenuous.

> Whereas, if they had been interpreted as Latin-1 characters, they
> would get written back as the UTF8 equivalents.  Hence you have the
> odd situation where you can decode and then encode and end up with a
> different string.

No, you can't unless you decode into a unibyte buffer, and then all bets
are off regarding reencoding.

-- 
David Kastrup




  parent reply	other threads:[~2014-03-29 17:16 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 103+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2014-03-26 19:04 Buffer-local variables affect general-purpose functions Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-26 19:32 ` Paul Eggert
2014-03-26 20:03   ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-26 21:50     ` Paul Eggert
2014-03-27 17:42       ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-27 18:55         ` Paul Eggert
2014-03-27 14:17 ` Stefan Monnier
2014-03-27 17:17   ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-27 21:04     ` Stefan Monnier
2014-03-28  7:11       ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-28  7:46         ` Paul Eggert
2014-03-28  8:18           ` Unibyte characters, strings and buffers Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-28 18:42             ` Paul Eggert
2014-03-28 18:52               ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-28 19:21                 ` Paul Eggert
2014-03-29  6:40                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-29 18:57                     ` Paul Eggert
2014-03-29 19:46                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-28 20:23                 ` Stefan Monnier
2014-03-29 19:34                 ` Stefan Monnier
2014-03-28 14:12         ` Buffer-local variables affect general-purpose functions Stefan Monnier
2014-03-28  3:38     ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2014-03-28  8:51       ` Unibyte characters, strings, and buffers Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-28 10:28         ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2014-03-28 10:58           ` David Kastrup
2014-03-28 11:22             ` Andreas Schwab
2014-03-28 11:34               ` David Kastrup
2014-03-28 11:42             ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2014-03-28 17:29           ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-28 17:50             ` David Kastrup
2014-03-28 18:31               ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-28 19:25                 ` David Kastrup
2014-03-29  6:43                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-29  7:23                     ` David Kastrup
2014-03-29  8:24                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-29  8:40                         ` David Kastrup
2014-03-29  9:25                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-28 20:27             ` Stefan Monnier
2014-03-29  9:23             ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2014-03-29  9:52               ` Andreas Schwab
2014-03-29 10:48                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-29 11:00                   ` Andreas Schwab
2014-03-29 11:18                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-29 11:30                       ` Andreas Schwab
     [not found]                         ` <83ha6hduzz.fsf@gnu.org>
2014-03-29 14:30                           ` Andreas Schwab
2014-03-29 14:47                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-29 10:42               ` David Kastrup
2014-03-29 11:07                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-29 11:30                   ` David Kastrup
2014-03-29 12:58                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-29 13:15                       ` David Kastrup
2014-03-29 10:44               ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-29 11:06               ` Andreas Schwab
2014-03-29 11:12                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-29 16:11                   ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2014-03-29 15:37                 ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2014-03-29 15:55                   ` David Kastrup
2014-03-29 16:28                     ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2014-03-29 17:00                       ` David Kastrup
2014-03-30  2:05                         ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2014-03-30  9:01                           ` David Kastrup
2014-03-30 12:13                             ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2014-03-30 14:25                             ` Andreas Schwab
2014-03-30 15:05                               ` David Kastrup
2014-03-30 15:39                                 ` Andreas Schwab
2014-03-29 17:08                       ` Andreas Schwab
2014-03-30  0:24                     ` Richard Stallman
2014-03-30  3:32                       ` Stefan Monnier
2014-03-30 15:13                         ` Richard Stallman
2014-03-29 15:58                   ` Andreas Schwab
2014-03-29 16:35                     ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2014-03-29 17:06                       ` Andreas Schwab
2014-03-29 17:01               ` Nathan Trapuzzano
2014-03-29 17:08                 ` Nathan Trapuzzano
2014-03-29 17:18                   ` David Kastrup
2014-03-29 17:33                     ` Nathan Trapuzzano
2014-03-30  0:24                       ` Richard Stallman
2014-03-30  8:38                         ` Andreas Schwab
2014-03-30 15:12                           ` Richard Stallman
2014-03-29 17:16                 ` David Kastrup [this message]
2014-03-28 18:45           ` Daniel Colascione
2014-03-28 19:35             ` Glenn Morris
2014-03-29 11:17             ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2014-03-29 11:22               ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-03-29 16:03                 ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2014-03-31 15:22                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-04-01  3:36                     ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2014-04-01  7:42                       ` David Kastrup
2014-04-01  9:38                         ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2014-04-01 15:19                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-04-01 15:16                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-04-02  4:20                         ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2014-04-02 17:06                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-04-03 10:59                             ` David Kastrup
2014-04-03 16:07                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-04-03 16:26                                 ` David Kastrup
2014-04-03 19:11                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-04-03 20:03                                     ` David Kastrup
2014-04-04  0:48                                       ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2014-04-04  8:08                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-04-04  7:58                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-04-04 11:40                                     ` Richard Stallman
2014-04-03 13:04                             ` Stephen J. Turnbull

Reply instructions:

You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:

* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
  and reply-to-all from there: mbox

  Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style

* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
  switches of git-send-email(1):

  git send-email \
    --in-reply-to=8738i1orgo.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org \
    --to=dak@gnu.org \
    --cc=emacs-devel@gnu.org \
    /path/to/YOUR_REPLY

  https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html

* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
  via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line before the message body.
Code repositories for project(s) associated with this external index

	https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs.git
	https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs/org-mode.git

This is an external index of several public inboxes,
see mirroring instructions on how to clone and mirror
all data and code used by this external index.