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From: dick <dick.r.chiang@gmail.com>
To: Arthur Miller <arthur.miller@live.com>
Cc: Philip Kaludercic <philipk@posteo.net>,
	Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca>,
	emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: Re: Easy configuration of a site-lisp directory
Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2021 07:50:58 -0400	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <8735rialb1.fsf@dick> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <AM9PR09MB497758B14D39B10EABA38A3896F69@AM9PR09MB4977.eurprd09.prod.outlook.com> (Arthur Miller's message of "Mon, 09 Aug 2021 08:52:13 +0200")

> Never heard of Elpaso before. What is the advantage compared to straight?

It embraces package.el.  Straight would prefer its users eliminate all
package.el configuration.  As I am a contemptuous (and contemptible) being,
I'll take this opportunity to badmouth straight.  Its answer to GNU ELPA being
"stupidly complex" was hosting a Heroku mirror to "bypass terrible package
management decisions" and to avoid having to understand the elpa-admin
code. [1] One particularly unsightly side effect of this is 50 lines of gnarly
elisp to get around org-mode's needing a preliminary call to `make`.

It's also impossible to take seriously a README that is 23,000 words, but what
do I know?  My reading of r/emacs suggests roughly half the forum's enthusiasts
use straight, not to mention all the zoomer doomers.

> a centralized reviewed source is also at least some security safety net.

Statements like this only encourage the invidious-minded among us to "check
your privilege."  It's obvious to everyone that baseline measures like
package-signing or secure http only ensure the trojan horse you're getting is
authentically the trojan horse that my blackhat alias wrote.  The ELPAs rely
on our good faith and the limited financial upside of exploiting a userbase of
our modest size (and probably modest means -- emacsers use free software not
only for philosophical reasons!).

[1] https://github.com/raxod502/straight.el/issues/762#issuecomment-841859211



  reply	other threads:[~2021-08-09 11:50 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 89+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2021-08-08 15:40 Easy configuration of a site-lisp directory Philip Kaludercic
2021-08-08 18:18 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-08-08 18:53   ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-08-08 20:03     ` Stefan Monnier
2021-08-08 22:43   ` dick
2021-08-08 23:16     ` Stefan Monnier
2021-08-09  0:43       ` dick
2021-08-09  3:13         ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2021-08-09 16:59           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-08-09 18:33             ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2021-08-09 18:49               ` dick
2021-08-09 22:11                 ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2021-08-10  8:24                   ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-10  8:31                 ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-09 18:52               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-08-09 22:14                 ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2021-08-10 11:55                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-08-10  8:10               ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-10 12:06                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-08-10 13:43                   ` Yuri Khan
2021-08-10 14:01                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-08-10 15:10                       ` Yuri Khan
2021-08-10 15:39                         ` dick
2021-08-10 15:49                           ` Stefan Monnier
2021-08-10 17:31                           ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-10 15:44                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-08-10 17:25                           ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2021-08-10 17:50                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-08-10 18:06                               ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2021-08-10 18:23                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-08-10 20:51                                 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-08-11  2:23                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-08-11  5:31                                     ` Stefan Monnier
2021-08-11 13:42                                     ` Basil L. Contovounesios
2021-08-11 16:34                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-08-11 18:21                                         ` Basil L. Contovounesios
2021-08-12  5:48                                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-08-10 17:35                         ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2021-08-10 17:24                     ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-10 17:22                   ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-10 17:45                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-08-09  6:52     ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-09 11:50       ` dick [this message]
2021-08-09 15:27         ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-19  9:25 ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-08-19 20:24   ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-19 21:43     ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-19 21:47       ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-19 21:59         ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-08-20  0:21           ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-20 21:36             ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-21  1:56               ` Stefan Monnier
2021-08-21  2:46                 ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-21  3:12                   ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-21  6:39                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-08-21  6:48                       ` tomas
2021-08-21  7:00                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-08-21  7:19                           ` symlinks and W32 [was: Easy configuration of a site-lisp directory] tomas
2021-08-21 14:15                             ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-21 14:20                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-08-21 19:12                                 ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-21 14:34                       ` Easy configuration of a site-lisp directory Arthur Miller
2021-08-21 14:42                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-08-21 19:10                           ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-21 19:18                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-08-21 20:25                               ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-22  6:03                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-08-25 10:47     ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-08-25 22:13       ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-26  9:42         ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-08-26 15:58           ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-20 10:23   ` Augusto Stoffel
2021-08-20 12:47     ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-23  9:14 ` Max Brieiev
2021-08-24 21:35   ` Stefan Monnier
2021-08-25 11:13     ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-08-25 14:37       ` Stefan Monnier
2021-08-25 14:55         ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-08-25 17:27           ` Stefan Monnier
2021-08-26  0:16             ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-26  4:10               ` Stefan Monnier
2021-08-26 15:38                 ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-26 18:03                   ` Stefan Monnier
2021-08-26 21:40                     ` Arthur Miller
2021-08-25 22:29           ` Arthur Miller
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2021-08-12  2:44 No Wayman
2021-08-12 12:41 ` dick
2021-08-12 14:48   ` No Wayman
2021-08-12 16:24     ` dick

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