From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "J.P." Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#73812: 30.0.91; ERC 5.6.0.30.1: Customizing erc-modules loads ERC when starting Emacs Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2024 08:40:54 -0700 Message-ID: <8734k9fxtl.fsf__25546.4001487539$1730562153$gmane$org@neverwas.me> References: <87o73mgjk3.fsf@neverwas.me> <865xptsh6f.fsf@gnu.org> <87h69ddz5l.fsf@neverwas.me> <86bjzhopaz.fsf@gnu.org> <87ttd947pg.fsf@neverwas.me> <87ed3z1tut.fsf@neverwas.me> <87cyjepihk.fsf@neverwas.me> <86ttcqyucg.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="19771"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Cc: 73812@debbugs.gnu.org, acorallo@gnu.org, emacs-erc@gnu.org, stefankangas@gmail.com To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Nov 02 16:42:25 2024 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1t7GGf-00050x-IU for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 02 Nov 2024 16:42:25 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1t7GGL-0008Hg-92; Sat, 02 Nov 2024 11:42:05 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1t7GGJ-0008HV-8v for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 02 Nov 2024 11:42:03 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:5::43]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1t7GGI-0006OG-Qk for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 02 Nov 2024 11:42:02 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=debbugs.gnu.org; s=debbugs-gnu-org; h=MIME-Version:Date:References:In-Reply-To:From:To:Subject; bh=zhK7g6p+Y/dV7PUqlb7+qiam7G3VJgMEWM3F3kjwmog=; b=jfyAJJAX/FwUUJY48wrbvsCwBd3pYQ1JRlMEW1brY8dCxmK1khVC/ZKOE7J8QHASbmU9dRMCpe7kYKxjdigqBZDgqH/VcKAz8YhFgA5Xgp/S8bNMARuiZLjajltJzYyqdKcJe79MbFdWn7G5p7HFfam2zSBJTrkPB4PDzQFH4YCh62pOc0kUEyLsBWYweHxMlwSUYIs783cthCFqhN07Iq/o6gS+ufmUcek2QB/VK68pQv3kX37KCQsmfcBxDcgIxL7IWqL0bdce7nC417uLyS/qQTrEnToVbXkuo0EEpuGbbHQM+QE1nI3C4h86jD8qxPlAIO/sqUldtKDIJrBR0Q==; Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1t7GGI-0007Ko-Eq for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 02 Nov 2024 11:42:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: "J.P." Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2024 15:42:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 73812 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: patch Original-Received: via spool by 73812-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B73812.173056206728169 (code B ref 73812); Sat, 02 Nov 2024 15:42:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 73812) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Nov 2024 15:41:07 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54052 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1t7GFP-0007KH-0x for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 Nov 2024 11:41:07 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-108-mta12.mxroute.com ([136.175.108.12]:45113) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1t7GFJ-0007Jn-TO for 73812@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 Nov 2024 11:41:05 -0400 Original-Received: from filter006.mxroute.com ([136.175.111.3] filter006.mxroute.com) (Authenticated sender: mN4UYu2MZsgR) by mail-108-mta12.mxroute.com (ZoneMTA) with ESMTPSA id 192ed8966a30003e01.001 for <73812@debbugs.gnu.org> (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384); Sat, 02 Nov 2024 15:40:57 +0000 X-Zone-Loop: a7f33a4055e23fcb746187d227ebb7931e5c3f42f0a5 X-Originating-IP: [136.175.111.3] DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=neverwas.me ; s=x; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:Date:References:In-Reply-To: Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe:List-Subscribe: List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=zhK7g6p+Y/dV7PUqlb7+qiam7G3VJgMEWM3F3kjwmog=; b=gKSblldibK+9Dk4phQl9diIFmP 9thrXW0AlyYRwSEUYYxjIapb4yUpOGuqdXyOhJ4civH1DBg64oi5Rw3SviWBRcSZxgcm8T0DNG2gJ mA/MNqyQNG9l7GupufG5O9D4Mi6RxZI+/Xxn7IRbmUp7mU4mpF2QeS9DA4Oi7KAG++0pLZH9XswDt 6JyjSvjsyIJe4c4r3H+bY46My7YN3QGXFGptgN3FXvAuD3uMH20ZhYXi1OjBB2rBRtEQ+5EFey6EO qrMtTZhvW31GMTjGcV0JGNoMyDwQgb2dNUTAiHzt7m7vzRC4vsHZj/ycx65VsjwzBf8/ninN/3O3E /dkKebhQ==; In-Reply-To: <86ttcqyucg.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sat, 02 Nov 2024 09:21:03 +0200") X-Authenticated-Id: masked@neverwas.me X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:294753 Archived-At: Eli Zaretskii writes: >> From: "J.P." >> Cc: 73812@debbugs.gnu.org, emacs-erc@gnu.org, Eli Zaretskii >> Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2024 17:49:43 -0700 >> >> Dear auxiliary maintainers, >> >> It seems Eli has tired of my nagging or is otherwise indisposed when it >> comes to this issue. > > I have not. But you made the mistake of quoting only a little bit > from the previous message, from which I couldn't even understand those > were my words. And I generally avoid commenting on changes related to > ERC because I don't use it and am not familiar with its code. > > In the future, if it's my/our decision that you are seeking, please > quote more of the context and ask for our response explicitly, to > avoid these misunderstandings. Makes sense. My apologies. > >> > Eli Zaretskii writes: >> > >> >>> All in all, I'd prefer to leave this alone in Emacs 30. We have time >> >>> to try reverting this on master and seeing whether it's a net win or a >> >>> net loss, given the past history of the issue. (AFAIU, if you remove >> >>> this line, some change is pertinent in the manual?) >> > >> > It's been reverted on master for ten days now with no complaints: >> > >> > https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs.git/commit/?id=1854f275 >> > >> > If that's long enough to qualify as a net win, can we proceed with a >> > backport? >> >> It's been two weeks now since I was tasked with reverting this on master >> in order to assess the damage, of which none has since been reported. >> >> Apologies if I'm out of line in pressing the issue, but I'm driven by a >> need to advocate for ERC's users, who've suffered greatly in the past >> due to my cowardliness in similar situations [1]. As such, I would very >> much appreciate a final verdict on this matter. > > I'd prefer to wait a little longer for any fallout of reverting this > on master. IME, two weeks is not long enough, as many people take > several weeks to update their builds. Emacs 30 is not going to be > released tomorrow, so we still have time. > > Let's talk about this in two more weeks, ok? Sounds good. Thanks.