From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: David Kastrup Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Change to bzr build instructions Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2011 14:07:10 +0100 Organization: Organization?!? Message-ID: <871v1v2vsx.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> References: <30r5a1s4kt.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <83fwqbtthq.fsf@gnu.org> <87aagj349j.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <83d3lftsf7.fsf@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1301058462 11586 80.91.229.12 (25 Mar 2011 13:07:42 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2011 13:07:42 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Mar 25 14:07:35 2011 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Q36jn-0001Wu-FR for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 25 Mar 2011 14:07:35 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:53572 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Q36jm-0000Qo-Pr for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 25 Mar 2011 09:07:34 -0400 Original-Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=42126 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Q36ji-0000QS-6Q for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 25 Mar 2011 09:07:31 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Q36jg-0004cn-Dd for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 25 Mar 2011 09:07:30 -0400 Original-Received: from lo.gmane.org ([80.91.229.12]:60317) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Q36jg-0004cG-31 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 25 Mar 2011 09:07:28 -0400 Original-Received: from list by lo.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Q36je-0001Te-Gh for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 25 Mar 2011 14:07:26 +0100 Original-Received: from p508ecfdf.dip.t-dialin.net ([80.142.207.223]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Fri, 25 Mar 2011 14:07:26 +0100 Original-Received: from dak by p508ecfdf.dip.t-dialin.net with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Fri, 25 Mar 2011 14:07:26 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-Lines: 35 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: p508ecfdf.dip.t-dialin.net X-Face: 2FEFf>]>q>2iw=B6, xrUubRI>pR&Ml9=ao@P@i)L:\urd*t9M~y1^:+Y]'C0~{mAl`oQuAl \!3KEIp?*w`|bL5qr,H)LFO6Q=qx~iH4DN; i"; /yuIsqbLLCh/!U#X[S~(5eZ41to5f%E@'ELIi$t^ Vc\LWP@J5p^rst0+('>Er0=^1{]M9!p?&:\z]|;&=NP3AhB!B_bi^]Pfkw User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:hG3NtOvQwCTMy20yVeQ/PD/kkMI= X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-Received-From: 80.91.229.12 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:137670 Archived-At: Leo writes: > On 2011-03-25 18:18 +0800, Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> Please stop the git propaganda here. The advantages and disadvantages >> of git vs bzr in this regard are well known and can be found with >> Google. > > I see no propaganda here. David merely mentions the way git handles > renames etc which is obviously better than bzr's. Uh, git does not "handle" renames, tracking them not at all. That's not actually "better" (and in fact, git history, particularly annotating and blaming is not the fastest as one consequence of this design choice). But it leaves one less opportunity for manual mistakes. > Why would bzr insist people remember to use bzr mv instead of the > shell command mv? Because it is a different approach. Explicit information, when given, beats guesswork. One has to keep in mind that Linux, for which git was designed, is a large-scale fast-turnaround software system with vast amounts of information flow and very widely distributed responsibility and mergeflows. Maintaining any side information manually (like we do with ChangeLog files) is more likely to be affected by shoddiness. We all know how much fun the ChangeLog files and their merges are in distributed development. When people try doing the same things with slightly different workflow, it is convenient when no conflicts occur as a result. So git took the design choice of not even remembering things that may or may not be shoddily maintained as "side information". With Bzr, people need to remember to _give_ this information explicitly. And of course this is relevant for Emacs developers using Bzr directly. -- David Kastrup