Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?

Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?

[Carsten Dominik]

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Dear all,

I am still receiving donations for Org-mode, even though right now I am
only formally the maintainer of Org (it is very difficult to make time free
for me, currently).  I would like to pass donations on to someone here who
has expenses related to Org, because this does not feel right anymore.

We used to have to pay for webhosting (which was generously donated by
Jason), but dreamhost is hosting us now for free.  Therefore i am not aware
of any costs beyond the $15/yr I am paying for the domain.  Please let me
know if you know a good way to spend donations at this moment.

- Carsten

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Re: Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?

[Joost Helberg]

Carsten,

back in the time when me and my friend created and sold the Snow Linux
Distribution, we donated all excess money to the FSF.

This was 20 years ago, but I think the FSF serves as much a purpose
then as it does nowadays.

regards,

Joost Helberg

>>>>> "Carsten" == Carsten Dominik <carsten.dominik@gmail.com> writes:
 > From: Carsten Dominik <carsten.dominik@gmail.com>
 > To: org-mode list <emacs-orgmode@gnu.org>
 > Subject: [O] Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?
 > Date: 12-Mar-14 18:53

 > Dear all,

 > I am still receiving donations for Org-mode, even though right now I am
 > only formally the maintainer of Org (it is very difficult to make time free
 > for me, currently).  I would like to pass donations on to someone here who
 > has expenses related to Org, because this does not feel right anymore.

 > We used to have to pay for webhosting (which was generously donated by
 > Jason), but dreamhost is hosting us now for free.  Therefore i am not aware
 > of any costs beyond the $15/yr I am paying for the domain.  Please let me
 > know if you know a good way to spend donations at this moment.

 > - Carsten

-- 
Snow B.V.

Re: Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?

[Thorsten Jolitz]

Joost Helberg <joost@snow.nl> writes:

> back in the time when me and my friend created and sold the Snow Linux
> Distribution, we donated all excess money to the FSF.
>
> This was 20 years ago, but I think the FSF serves as much a purpose
> then as it does nowadays.

Wouldn't it be a better idea to compensate those who currently maintain
Org-mode informally, i.e. who still keep things (and the mailing list)
running and responsive?

I would suggest to pass donations to Bastien and/or anybody who is
actually doing the job of a maintainer, even if not with full
intensity, to compensate him/them for time and effort. 

>>>>>> "Carsten" == Carsten Dominik <carsten.dominik@gmail.com> writes:
>  > From: Carsten Dominik <carsten.dominik@gmail.com>
>  > To: org-mode list <emacs-orgmode@gnu.org>
>  > Subject: [O] Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?
>  > Date: 12-Mar-14 18:53
>
>  > Dear all,
>
>  > I am still receiving donations for Org-mode, even though right now I am
>  > only formally the maintainer of Org (it is very difficult to make
>  > time free
>  > for me, currently).  I would like to pass donations on to someone
>  > here who
>  > has expenses related to Org, because this does not feel right anymore.
>
>  > We used to have to pay for webhosting (which was generously donated by
>  > Jason), but dreamhost is hosting us now for free.  Therefore i am
>  > not aware
>  > of any costs beyond the $15/yr I am paying for the domain.  Please
>  > let me
>  > know if you know a good way to spend donations at this moment.


-- 
cheers,
Thorsten

Re: Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?

[Achim Gratz]

Carsten Dominik writes:
> I am still receiving donations for Org-mode, even though right now I
> am only formally the maintainer of Org (it is very difficult to make
> time free for me, currently). I would like to pass donations on to
> someone here who has expenses related to Org, because this does not
> feel right anymore.
>
> We used to have to pay for webhosting (which was generously donated by
> Jason), but dreamhost is hosting us now for free. Therefore i am not
> aware of any costs beyond the $15/yr I am paying for the domain.
> Please let me know if you know a good way to spend donations at this
> moment.

That's an interesting problem to have... :-)

Since Org certainly builds on Emacs, there's always the possibility to
see if Emacs' folks could need some support.  If package manager would
grow up to deal correctly with packages as large and complex as Org and
actually install them correctly without horrible workarounds, that would
certainly be something that Org would benefit from enormously.


Regards,
Achim.
-- 
+<[Q+ Matrix-12 WAVE#46+305 Neuron microQkb Andromeda XTk Blofeld]>+

SD adaptation for Waldorf rackAttack V1.04R1:
http://Synth.Stromeko.net/Downloads.html#WaldorfSDada

Re: Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?

[Bastien]

Hi Carsten and all,

Achim Gratz <Stromeko@nexgo.de> writes:

> That's an interesting problem to have... :-)

FWIW I support Joost proposal to donate to the FSF.

But I'd be interested to know if Emacs maintainers accept donations.
If they do, I'd split donations between FSF and Emacs maintainers.

> Since Org certainly builds on Emacs, there's always the possibility to
> see if Emacs' folks could need some support.  If package manager would
> grow up to deal correctly with packages as large and complex as Org and
> actually install them correctly without horrible workarounds, that would
> certainly be something that Org would benefit from enormously.

Well... yes, except I doubt we can make such a targetted donation.
(I would love to, though.)

-- 
 Bastien

Re: Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?

[Sebastien Vauban]

Hello Carsten,

> I am still receiving donations for Org-mode, even though right now I am
> only formally the maintainer of Org (it is very difficult to make time free
> for me, currently).  I would like to pass donations on to someone here who
> has expenses related to Org, because this does not feel right anymore.

I'd say that Bastien and Nicolas should be in that list, for sure.

> We used to have to pay for webhosting (which was generously donated by
> Jason), but dreamhost is hosting us now for free.  Therefore i am not aware
> of any costs beyond the $15/yr I am paying for the domain.  Please let me
> know if you know a good way to spend donations at this moment.

Best regards,
  Seb

-- 
Sebastien Vauban

Re: Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?

[Xebar Saram]

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+1 for Bastien for what its worth (im a relatively neewb but Bastien has
been truly epic in helping new users)

best

Z


On Wed, Mar 12, 2014 at 9:32 PM, Sebastien Vauban
<sva-news@mygooglest.com>wrote:

> Hello Carsten,
>
> > I am still receiving donations for Org-mode, even though right now I am
> > only formally the maintainer of Org (it is very difficult to make time
> free
> > for me, currently).  I would like to pass donations on to someone here
> who
> > has expenses related to Org, because this does not feel right anymore.
>
> I'd say that Bastien and Nicolas should be in that list, for sure.
>
> > We used to have to pay for webhosting (which was generously donated by
> > Jason), but dreamhost is hosting us now for free.  Therefore i am not
> aware
> > of any costs beyond the $15/yr I am paying for the domain.  Please let me
> > know if you know a good way to spend donations at this moment.
>
> Best regards,
>   Seb
>
> --
> Sebastien Vauban
>
>
>

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Re: Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?

[William Denton]

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How much money is coming in?  Might there be something that could be paid for 
that would be helpful, such as getting professionally done subtitles/captions on 
one of the videos?  Or something else that's in the class of tasks that someone 
could volunteer to do but if it's possible to spend a bit of money to get it 
really well done then it ends up being worth it.  I have no strong opinion about 
the money but wanted to mention this as a possible idea.

My continuing thanks to Bastien, Nicholas, Carsten and everyone else for such 
amazing work on Org!

Bill
-- 
▮ William Denton ▮ Toronto, Canada ▮ http://www.miskatonic.org/ ▮

Re: Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?

[Ilya Shlyakhter]

On 3/12/14 2:14 PM, Joost Helberg wrote:
> back in the time when me and my friend created and sold the Snow Linux
> Distribution, we donated all excess money to the FSF.

If people wanted to give to the FSF, they would have done it directly.
I've donated to Org in the past not to defray expenses but as a small 
token of thanks to Carsten & the principal maintainers.  Putting the 
donations to whatever personal use they want was the intention.

Re: Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?

[Jambunathan K]

Carsten Dominik <carsten.dominik@gmail.com> writes:

> I would like to pass donations

Undoubtedly, to Nicolas Goaziou.

Re: Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?

[Ian Barton]

On 12/03/14 20:50, William Denton wrote:
> How much money is coming in?  Might there be something that could be
> paid for that would be helpful, such as getting professionally done
> subtitles/captions on one of the videos?  Or something else that's in
> the class of tasks that someone could volunteer to do but if it's
> possible to spend a bit of money to get it really well done then it ends
> up being worth it.  I have no strong opinion about the money but wanted
> to mention this as a possible idea.
>
> My continuing thanks to Bastien, Nicholas, Carsten and everyone else for
> such amazing work on Org!
>
> Bill

Just to throw in another possibility, what about helping to sponsor an 
org conference? Obviously not paying for a whole conference, but perhaps 
helping speakers to attend.

Ian.

Re: Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?

[David Masterson]

Carsten Dominik <carsten.dominik@gmail.com> writes:

> Dear all,
>
> I am still receiving donations for Org-mode, even though right now I
> am only formally the maintainer of Org (it is very difficult to make
> time free for me, currently). I would like to pass donations on to
> someone here who has expenses related to Org, because this does not
> feel right anymore.
>
> We used to have to pay for webhosting (which was generously donated by
> Jason), but dreamhost is hosting us now for free. Therefore i am not
> aware of any costs beyond the $15/yr I am paying for the domain.
> Please let me know if you know a good way to spend donations at this
> moment.

My suggestion would be to use the money to pay for enhancements to Org.
Take a look at the list of projects for Org, find the most difficult and
complex project(s), put the money into a fund to be given to the
developer(s) who provide the best approach to solving the problems
involved.

Wasn't there a website somewhere that provided a means for managing
this type of idea?  (Pledgie?)

-- 
David Masterson

Re: Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?

[Eric Schulte]

Here's an impractical option.  I see roughly 280 different contributors
to Org-mode.

    git log|grep "^Author"|sed 's/^.*: //;s/<.*$//'|less|sort|uniq|less

Maybe buy every contributor an Org-mode mug?

-- 
Eric Schulte
https://cs.unm.edu/~eschulte
PGP: 0x614CA05D

Re: Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?

[Carsten Dominik]

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Hi all,

one question that was asked:  How much donations come in?  That varies.
Some month it is $10, occasionally it can be $100.

What Bastien and I have done in the past is use this money in a more or
less private way.  I think Bastien has at some point replaced his laptop in
this way, and all in all I have done the same, I think.  This felt OK
previously, but it is not longer the right thing as far as I am concerned.

I have seen a few good ideas here.

1. Send it to the FSF.  That is a possibility, but lets first try to do
something more Org specific

2. A Mug for every contributor.  Stretches the available budget, and is
work.
We could make a list of contributors and start from the most commits or
something.

3. Help organise a conference.  That would be a very good goal.  Are there
any plans to organise a conference?

4. Redistribute to the most active developers for lighting up their day.

I propose the following:  Starting March 1, I will report here the
donations I get once a month, and we will keep track of it and find a good
way to spend it.  So far this month: $66.  Lets revisit the discussion in 2
or three months. Maybe by then there will be plans for a conference, if
not, we see.

- Carsten


On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 8:55 PM, Eric Schulte <schulte.eric@gmail.com>wrote:

> Here's an impractical option.  I see roughly 280 different contributors
> to Org-mode.
>
>     git log|grep "^Author"|sed 's/^.*: //;s/<.*$//'|less|sort|uniq|less
>
> Maybe buy every contributor an Org-mode mug?
>
> --
> Eric Schulte
> https://cs.unm.edu/~eschulte
> PGP: 0x614CA05D
>
>

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Re: Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?

[Eric S Fraga]

Eric Schulte <schulte.eric@gmail.com> writes:

> Here's an impractical option.  I see roughly 280 different contributors
> to Org-mode.

and don't forget all those that have contributed to Worg!

I have no better suggestions for what to do with the monies that may
come in, especially as I don't have any idea of the scale.  However, the
suggestion of providing some support for org workshops or conferences
has a certain appeal.
-- 
: Eric S Fraga (0xFFFCF67D), Emacs 24.3.1, Org release_8.2.5h-660-gef207f

Re: Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?

[Joost Helberg]

Carsten,

I was at the Emacs Conference in London back in 2013; it was a great
experience and there were people from all over the world (only <50%
org-moders).

The idea of an org-mode conference is cool. I'm happy to provide
facilities in Geldermalsen, the Netherlands at Snow, but Amsterdam,
London or Paris seem like a better fit for this.

We may consider piggybacking on the Emacs Conference though, I'm not
sure when it's coming back, but it's something worth trying; it saves a
lot of travelling.

Saving money for an org-mode conference certainly is in line with the
intention of the people behind the donations. In fact, I'll be happy to
donate money then.

regards,

Joost Helberg

>>>>> "Carsten" == Carsten Dominik <carsten.dominik@gmail.com> writes:
 > From: Carsten Dominik <carsten.dominik@gmail.com>
 > To: Eric Schulte <schulte.eric@gmail.com>
 > Cc: org-mode list <emacs-orgmode@gnu.org>
 > Subject: Re: [O] Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?
 > Date: 13-Mar-14 23:06

 > Hi all,

 > one question that was asked:  How much donations come in?  That varies.
 > Some month it is $10, occasionally it can be $100.

 > What Bastien and I have done in the past is use this money in a more or
 > less private way.  I think Bastien has at some point replaced his laptop in
 > this way, and all in all I have done the same, I think.  This felt OK
 > previously, but it is not longer the right thing as far as I am concerned.

 > I have seen a few good ideas here.

 > 1. Send it to the FSF.  That is a possibility, but lets first try to do
 > something more Org specific

 > 2. A Mug for every contributor.  Stretches the available budget, and is
 > work.
 > We could make a list of contributors and start from the most commits or
 > something.

 > 3. Help organise a conference.  That would be a very good goal.  Are there
 > any plans to organise a conference?

 > 4. Redistribute to the most active developers for lighting up their day.

 > I propose the following:  Starting March 1, I will report here the
 > donations I get once a month, and we will keep track of it and find a good
 > way to spend it.  So far this month: $66.  Lets revisit the discussion in 2
 > or three months. Maybe by then there will be plans for a conference, if
 > not, we see.

 > - Carsten


 > On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 8:55 PM, Eric Schulte <schulte.eric@gmail.com>wrote:

 >> Here's an impractical option.  I see roughly 280 different contributors
 >> to Org-mode.
 >> 
 >> git log|grep "^Author"|sed 's/^.*: //;s/<.*$//'|less|sort|uniq|less
 >> 
 >> Maybe buy every contributor an Org-mode mug?
 >> 
 >> --
 >> Eric Schulte
 >> https://cs.unm.edu/~eschulte
 >> PGP: 0x614CA05D
 >> 
 >> 

-- 
Snow B.V.

Re: Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?

[Jambunathan K]

If I were you, I will segregate the funds as though the contributor -
developer or otherwise - will receive it.

Then, I will approach each contributor with,

    This is your fair share.  Please receive it.  If the contributor
    declines, I will ask the contributor "How do you think I should
    deploy your fair share?"


Carsten Dominik <carsten.dominik@gmail.com> writes:

> Hi all,
>
> one question that was asked: How much donations come in? That varies.
> Some month it is $10, occasionally it can be $100.
>
> What Bastien and I have done in the past is use this money in a more
> or less private way. I think Bastien has at some point replaced his
> laptop in this way, and all in all I have done the same, I think. This
> felt OK previously, but it is not longer the right thing as far as I
> am concerned.
>
> I have seen a few good ideas here.
>
> 1. Send it to the FSF. That is a possibility, but lets first try to do
> something more Org specific
>
> 2. A Mug for every contributor. Stretches the available budget, and is
> work.
> We could make a list of contributors and start from the most commits
> or something.
>
> 3. Help organise a conference. That would be a very good goal. Are
> there any plans to organise a conference?
>
> 4. Redistribute to the most active developers for lighting up their
> day.
>
> I propose the following: Starting March 1, I will report here the
> donations I get once a month, and we will keep track of it and find a
> good way to spend it. So far this month: $66. Lets revisit the
> discussion in 2 or three months. Maybe by then there will be plans for
> a conference, if not, we see.
>
> - Carsten
>
> On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 8:55 PM, Eric Schulte <schulte.eric@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>     Here's an impractical option. I see roughly 280 different
>     contributors
>     to Org-mode.
>     
>     git log|grep "^Author"|sed 's/^.*:
>     //;s/<.*$//'|less|sort|uniq|less
>     
>     Maybe buy every contributor an Org-mode mug?
>     
>     --
>     Eric Schulte
>     https://cs.unm.edu/~eschulte
>     PGP: 0x614CA05D
>     
>     

Re: Is anyone spending money for Org-mode?

[Marcin Borkowski]

Dnia 2014-03-13, o godz. 11:49:47
David Masterson <dsmasterson@gmail.com> napisał(a):

> My suggestion would be to use the money to pay for enhancements to
> Org. Take a look at the list of projects for Org, find the most
> difficult and complex project(s), put the money into a fund to be
> given to the developer(s) who provide the best approach to solving
> the problems involved.

+1!!!

As for donating to Emacs/FSF: -1 from me (someone stated a good reason:
folks could donate there directly).

Best,

-- 
Marcin Borkowski
http://octd.wmi.amu.edu.pl/en/Marcin_Borkowski
Adam Mickiewicz University