From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Emanuel Berg Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Is Elisp really that slow? Date: Thu, 16 May 2019 01:02:36 +0200 Message-ID: <86v9ybs4mr.fsf@zoho.eu> References: <83h89zbndc.fsf@gnu.org> <875zqfv7sb.fsf@telefonica.net> <86tvdywhjr.fsf@zoho.eu> <20190514082443.GA11039@tuxteam.de> <86o945uq6l.fsf@zoho.eu> <20190514144406.GA24295@tuxteam.de> <861s10ufh6.fsf@zoho.eu> <20190515120553.GK32396@tuxteam.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: blaine.gmane.org; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:195.159.176.226"; logging-data="173509"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@blaine.gmane.org" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.1 (gnu/linux) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu May 16 01:03:17 2019 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1hR2vc-000j0F-4x for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 16 May 2019 01:03:16 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:44835 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1hR2vb-0000S0-7u for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Wed, 15 May 2019 19:03:15 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:57925) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1hR2vA-0000Kd-3N for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 15 May 2019 19:02:50 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1hR2v7-0005QT-OB for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 15 May 2019 19:02:47 -0400 Original-Received: from [195.159.176.226] (port=37572 helo=blaine.gmane.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1hR2v7-0005Om-CH for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 15 May 2019 19:02:45 -0400 Original-Received: from list by blaine.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1hR2v5-000iJr-CY for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 16 May 2019 01:02:43 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Mail-Followup-To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Mail-Copies-To: never Cancel-Lock: sha1:GlFoZr1MU3rGx+vfYRWJcXJK5nA= X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 195.159.176.226 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "help-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:120429 Archived-At: tomas wrote: > The point I wanted to make is that Emacs has > been very good at keeping itself hackable, > and this seems a more important metrics than > raw speed, given Emacs's "mission". To make Emacs less hackable isn't allowed :) And Emacs in general is already fast. I do things much faster than most people who use modern GUIs. I type faster, I switch between programs faster, everything is more integrated, and so on - it is fast! That doesn't mean I do more productive stuff for every given computer hour. Sometimes it works the opposite way, one discovers some detail, gets an idea, and spend an hour on some thing which really doesn't matter. But it is fun and rewarding, so in a way it does. It is meaningless, but if it's meaningless, one might as well do it :) But if we return to (in your words) "raw speed", I like that as well, so it ain't to dismiss the discussion. (BTW did the subject change or am I tripping?!?) > Hm. I see. Did you file a bug report? I don't remember the details but it was solved with the help from the gmane.emacs.w3m guys, yes. >> You mean this one: >> >> (info "(elisp) Writing Emacs Primitives") > > Yes. Following this has the downside that you > end up with a "modified Emacs". Right, but as you still need to recompile it, you have no choice anyway, you must get the source and build it manually, right? But, one can use the repo Emacs for everyday purposes, and then have one other to experiment on. Perhaps that gets tangled up in the initial phase but I'm sure it gets worked out eventually. > Thus, perhaps "E8 Writing Dynamically-Loaded > Modules", where your C functions end up in > a separate library, loaded by Emacs at run > time, is more interesting. Aha, so you can do that! Wonderful! Only... I don't find it? ;; DNC (info "(emacs) Writing Dynamically-Loaded Modules") (info "(elisp) Writing Dynamically-Loaded Modules") Where is it? And what is this "E8" notation? > That said, it is always a trade-off: stuff > written in Elisp is far more hackable, so > writing extensions in C takes a lot of > consideration and a good interface design > (how could people want to use my new > function?), given the "hackability cost". Well, I've written enough Elisp by now anyway. Time to move on :) -- underground experts united http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573 https://dataswamp.org/~incal