From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Evans Winner Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: basic question: going back to dired Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2008 10:13:19 -0600 Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server Message-ID: <86r69laodc.fsf@timbral.net> References: <4884DC7F.6060406@gmail.com> <819feff4-76e3-4bf8-9ece-7b47f099efc2@j22g2000hsf.googlegroups.com> <87hcaiiatp.fsf@bzg.ath.cx> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1216744856 16653 80.91.229.12 (22 Jul 2008 16:40:56 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2008 16:40:56 +0000 (UTC) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Jul 22 18:41:45 2008 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1KLKvd-00072f-7m for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 18:41:33 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:57642 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1KLKuk-0008MR-2V for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 12:40:38 -0400 Original-Path: news.stanford.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!news.tele.dk!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!newsfeed.icl.net!newsfeed.fjserv.net!newsfeed.freenet.de!news.k-dsl.de!aioe.org!not-for-mail Original-Newsgroups: gnu.emacs.help Original-Lines: 42 Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: tHL7Pw00KvzSeEbptdOqCQ.user.aioe.org Original-X-Complaints-To: abuse@aioe.org Cancel-Lock: sha1:8XcNNIH5z5TF/XNHbgC8b+fB/po= User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.0.60 (gnu/linux) Original-Xref: news.stanford.edu gnu.emacs.help:160466 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:55811 Archived-At: "Juanma Barranquero" writes: I'm not for or against changing Emacs' terminology. I think it would be a huge amount of work. But I don't understand why some people reacts as if the very idea is flawed. There's nothing sacred in "buffer" and "keybinding" and "minibuffer", just history. The change should be susceptible to rational (if perhaps a bit pointless) discussion, because it is not hard to find good arguments for it; "frame/window" vs "window/pane" is a good example. The issue is not history or short-term convenience for new users but precision. Emacs does not use workspaces or panes, but buffers. A user who wants to write a little code to do something useful needs to know that essentially the same function that is used to open a file and write text in it manually is what is used to create any buffer, even one that never displays anything, has some processing go on in it and then vanishes--that the display of data in a buffer is a separate thing from the data structure itself; or why some buffers are associated with files and others, like completion buffers have no file associated with them, and how to write programs that take advantage of the same functionality. A person who has been told that he is working with ``windows'' (meaning buffers in Emacs) is thus conceptually crippled if he wants to do something that could be done with buffers other than using them as windows. Xah Lee has written about the danger of excessive use of jargon in computer work and I generally agree with him, but even more dangerous is the use of metaphor. A metaphor, like ``workspace'' only tells you as much about a thing as the inventor of the metaphor wanted you to know, but makes it impossible to extend your understanding past that. If the term keybinding ought to be changed to anything it should be rather something like input-binding (since function execution can be triggered by any form of input, not just keyboard presses) than ``shortcut'' or whatever such woozy nonsense.