From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: David Kastrup Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel,gmane.emacs.pretest.bugs Subject: Re: 23.0.60; [nxml] BOM and utf-8 Date: Sun, 18 May 2008 11:14:46 +0200 Message-ID: <85y768ug6x.fsf@lola.goethe.zz> References: <87od75kt78.fsf@pdrechsler.de> <87mymofip6.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <878wy8ny36.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <87k5hsfdvd.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1211102144 17678 80.91.229.12 (18 May 2008 09:15:44 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 18 May 2008 09:15:44 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-pretest-bug@gnu.org, Patrick Drechsler , Miles Bader To: "Stephen J. Turnbull" Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun May 18 11:16:19 2008 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1Jxf07-0008CR-28 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 18 May 2008 11:16:19 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:59212 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1JxezL-0003Q9-N5 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 18 May 2008 05:15:32 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1Jxeyn-0003OG-Fl for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 18 May 2008 05:14:57 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1Jxeyj-0003NB-3z for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 18 May 2008 05:14:54 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=57287 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Jxeyi-0003Mx-Kj for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 18 May 2008 05:14:52 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]:60932) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1Jxeyi-0002aC-8i for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 18 May 2008 05:14:52 -0400 Original-Received: from mx10.gnu.org ([199.232.76.166]:48484) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1JxexY-0006jQ-Ud for emacs-pretest-bug@gnu.org; Sun, 18 May 2008 05:13:41 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by monty-python.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1Jxeye-0002Zk-Pc for emacs-pretest-bug@gnu.org; Sun, 18 May 2008 05:14:51 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-in-06.arcor-online.net ([151.189.21.46]:53760) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1Jxeye-0002ZV-EA; Sun, 18 May 2008 05:14:48 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-in-17-z2.arcor-online.net (mail-in-17-z2.arcor-online.net [151.189.8.34]) by mail-in-06.arcor-online.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1269131E82A; Sun, 18 May 2008 11:14:47 +0200 (CEST) Original-Received: from mail-in-16.arcor-online.net (mail-in-16.arcor-online.net [151.189.21.56]) by mail-in-17-z2.arcor-online.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F341D45C281; Sun, 18 May 2008 11:14:46 +0200 (CEST) Original-Received: from lola.goethe.zz (dslb-084-061-092-161.pools.arcor-ip.net [84.61.92.161]) by mail-in-16.arcor-online.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 78B2C236E44; Sun, 18 May 2008 11:14:46 +0200 (CEST) Original-Received: by lola.goethe.zz (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 1EF941C464F7; Sun, 18 May 2008 11:14:46 +0200 (CEST) In-Reply-To: <87k5hsfdvd.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> (Stephen J. Turnbull's message of "Sun, 18 May 2008 13:13:58 +0900") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.0.60 (gnu/linux) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.92.1/7147/Sun May 18 03:30:04 2008 on mail-in-16.arcor-online.net X-Virus-Status: Clean X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.4-2.6 X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.6, seldom 2.4 (older, 4) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:97356 gmane.emacs.pretest.bugs:22373 Archived-At: "Stephen J. Turnbull" writes: > So pop up a warning to the effect that the BOM was stripped per the > Unicode standard, and that if it needs to be preserved, set > UNICODE_ME_SOFTLY in the environment or bind `unicode-me-softly' > around the codec. It would be sufficient to use an encoding variation which adds the bom back on writing. I am actually surprised that this is not done right now: I thought we had a discussion about having the BOM-encodings early in the automatic encoding detections. > Alternatively, sabotage the Microsoft users by silently eating the BOM > on the way in, and writing the file in GNU substandard[1] format on > the way out. Emacs developers are not nonchalant about having Emacs write a byte sequence differing from what it read in (apart from where it can't help it, like with non-canonically encoded valid texts in shift character based encodings) in my impression, and it is one of the better features. -- David Kastrup, Kriemhildstr. 15, 44793 Bochum