From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: David Kastrup Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel,gmane.emacs.pretest.bugs Subject: Re: 23.0.60; M-( and M-) should not be bound in ESC map Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2008 23:09:26 +0200 Message-ID: <85d4ox1kop.fsf@lola.goethe.zz> References: <003801c89a85$fcd95ad0$c2b22382@us.oracle.com> <20080410154940.GB7700@muc.de> <20080410162459.GC7700@muc.de> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1207861950 31973 80.91.229.12 (10 Apr 2008 21:12:30 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2008 21:12:30 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Alan Mackenzie , Richard Stallman , emacs-pretest-bug@gnu.org To: "Juanma Barranquero" Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Apr 10 23:13:02 2008 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1Jk44A-0006x9-8X for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2008 23:12:18 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Jk43W-0000zE-Iv for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2008 17:11:38 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1Jk42b-0000VX-7x for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2008 17:10:41 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1Jk42V-0000SG-TG for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2008 17:10:39 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Jk42V-0000Rt-0D for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2008 17:10:35 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1Jk42U-0005sP-Dp for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2008 17:10:34 -0400 Original-Received: from mail.gnu.org ([199.232.76.166] helo=mx10.gnu.org) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Jk41g-0006rZ-AV for emacs-pretest-bug@gnu.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2008 17:09:44 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by monty-python.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1Jk41Y-0005FA-Fs for emacs-pretest-bug@gnu.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2008 17:09:42 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-in-11.arcor-online.net ([151.189.21.51]) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1Jk41W-0005Db-Jg; Thu, 10 Apr 2008 17:09:35 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-in-14-z2.arcor-online.net (mail-in-14-z2.arcor-online.net [151.189.8.31]) by mail-in-11.arcor-online.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C8502096BD; Thu, 10 Apr 2008 23:09:32 +0200 (CEST) Original-Received: from mail-in-01.arcor-online.net (mail-in-01.arcor-online.net [151.189.21.41]) by mail-in-14-z2.arcor-online.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 75909100F6; Thu, 10 Apr 2008 23:09:32 +0200 (CEST) Original-Received: from lola.goethe.zz (dslb-084-061-053-017.pools.arcor-ip.net [84.61.53.17]) by mail-in-01.arcor-online.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 53FA5104530; Thu, 10 Apr 2008 23:09:32 +0200 (CEST) Original-Received: by lola.goethe.zz (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 7B5EE1C4DC09; Thu, 10 Apr 2008 23:09:26 +0200 (CEST) In-Reply-To: (Juanma Barranquero's message of "Thu, 10 Apr 2008 18:15:03 +0200") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.0.60 (gnu/linux) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.92.1/6697/Thu Apr 10 17:05:46 2008 on mail-in-01.arcor-online.net X-Virus-Status: Clean X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.4-2.6 X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.6, seldom 2.4 (older, 4) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:94901 gmane.emacs.pretest.bugs:21967 Archived-At: "Juanma Barranquero" writes: > I was not talking specifically about recent discussions. It was the > feeling gathered after five years of emacs-devel. All user-visible > changes cause long threads, heated comments and few decisions. It also causes the abandonment of bad compromises. Many of those discussions have resulted in code and behavior that would be an overall improvement, meaning that it retained its usefulness for its proponents while not being a regression for its opponents. Waxing poetical, moving from raw to cooked state might require heat at times. If the aim of this discussion list was to make everybody like everybody else, it probably could be called not quite effective. But its aim is the development and improvement of Emacs. And those few decisions which caused long threads, all in all, tended to be decisions in the need of cooking. When the decision finally was made, it was rarely about the same code that started the discussion. -- David Kastrup, Kriemhildstr. 15, 44793 Bochum