Re: w3 and css

Re: w3 and css

[Harald Hanche-Olsen]

[Andrea Crotti <andrea.crotti.0@gmail.com>]

> I think I never actually saw w3 working on my machine, so I finally
> wanted to get it working.
>
> I downloaded from the git repository here
> http://www.gnu.org/software/w3/

I thought w3 was dead, so this got me all exited.
Indeed the web site says “Emacs/W3 is dead, long live Emacs/W3”
so I thought it had been revived, and maybe it has – but I downloaded
the git repository and ran git log, which tells me the latest revision
to the code was in May 2008. This does not bode well.

A little more detail: It looks like development came to a halt in 2002,
with a couple of fixes in 2003, then a hiatus until 2006, after which
the project was continued by Magnus Henoch until May 2008. Whether he
has abandoned it or he does not see any needs for further improvement is
unclear to me. The w3-announce mailing list archives are full of spam.
The w3-devel mailing list (http://news.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.w3.devel)
has a question similar to yours dated 15 Nov 2009 that looks similar to
yours, and which was never answered on the list.

My own very tentative conclusion is that w3 is still dead, and that w3m
is a better bet. But I'll follow this thread with interest in case
someone wants to tell us otherwise.

-- 
* Harald Hanche-Olsen     <URL:http://www.math.ntnu.no/~hanche/>
- It is undesirable to believe a proposition
  when there is no ground whatsoever for supposing it is true.
  -- Bertrand Russell

Re: w3 and css

[Andrea Crotti]

Il giorno 19/feb/2011, alle ore 11.27, Harald Hanche-Olsen ha scritto:
> 
> I thought w3 was dead, so this got me all exited.
> Indeed the web site says “Emacs/W3 is dead, long live Emacs/W3”
> so I thought it had been revived, and maybe it has – but I downloaded
> the git repository and ran git log, which tells me the latest revision
> to the code was in May 2008. This does not bode well.
> 
> A little more detail: It looks like development came to a halt in 2002,
> with a couple of fixes in 2003, then a hiatus until 2006, after which
> the project was continued by Magnus Henoch until May 2008. Whether he
> has abandoned it or he does not see any needs for further improvement is
> unclear to me. The w3-announce mailing list archives are full of spam.
> The w3-devel mailing list (http://news.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.w3.devel)
> has a question similar to yours dated 15 Nov 2009 that looks similar to
> yours, and which was never answered on the list.
> 
> My own very tentative conclusion is that w3 is still dead, and that w3m
> is a better bet. But I'll follow this thread with interest in case
> someone wants to tell us otherwise.
> 
> -- 
> * Harald Hanche-Olsen     <URL:http://www.math.ntnu.no/~hanche/>
> - It is undesirable to believe a proposition
>  when there is no ground whatsoever for supposing it is true.
>  -- Bertrand Russell


Ah good I didn't check it was dead.
I think I had the same problem last time :)
Maybe it's not worth to implement such a complicated thing like a browser in elisp,
there are way too many things to take care of.

Anyway w3m from this page http://emacs-w3m.namazu.org/index-en.html
doesn't really look in a good shape either, last release in 2005...

I don't really need much, I just wanted to see simple html+css pages in emacs...

Re: w3 and css

[Tim X]

Andrea Crotti <andrea.crotti.0@gmail.com> writes:

> Il giorno 19/feb/2011, alle ore 11.27, Harald Hanche-Olsen ha scritto:
>> 
>> I thought w3 was dead, so this got me all exited.
>> Indeed the web site says “Emacs/W3 is dead, long live Emacs/W3”
>> so I thought it had been revived, and maybe it has – but I downloaded
>> the git repository and ran git log, which tells me the latest revision
>> to the code was in May 2008. This does not bode well.
>> 
>> A little more detail: It looks like development came to a halt in 2002,
>> with a couple of fixes in 2003, then a hiatus until 2006, after which
>> the project was continued by Magnus Henoch until May 2008. Whether he
>> has abandoned it or he does not see any needs for further improvement is
>> unclear to me. The w3-announce mailing list archives are full of spam.
>> The w3-devel mailing list (http://news.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.w3.devel)
>> has a question similar to yours dated 15 Nov 2009 that looks similar to
>> yours, and which was never answered on the list.
>> 
>> My own very tentative conclusion is that w3 is still dead, and that w3m
>> is a better bet. But I'll follow this thread with interest in case
>> someone wants to tell us otherwise.
>> 
>> -- 
>> * Harald Hanche-Olsen     <URL:http://www.math.ntnu.no/~hanche/>
>> - It is undesirable to believe a proposition
>>  when there is no ground whatsoever for supposing it is true.
>>  -- Bertrand Russell
>
>
> Ah good I didn't check it was dead.
> I think I had the same problem last time :)
> Maybe it's not worth to implement such a complicated thing like a browser in elisp,
> there are way too many things to take care of.
>
> Anyway w3m from this page http://emacs-w3m.namazu.org/index-en.html
> doesn't really look in a good shape either, last release in 2005...
>
The w3m-el (i.e. elisp wrapper around w3m) is still being actively
developed (last commit from the log is 19th Jan 2011). Don't know about
w3m, but fromt he changelog on my system, the last entry is 31-05-2007. 

Tim


-- 
tcross (at) rapttech dot com dot au

Re: w3 and css

[William F Hammond]

>> I downloaded from the git repository here
>> http://www.gnu.org/software/w3/
>
> I thought w3 was dead, so this got me all exited.
> Indeed the web site says “Emacs/W3 is dead, long live Emacs/W3”
> so I thought it had been revived, and maybe it has – but I downloaded
> the git repository and ran git log, which tells me the latest revision
> to the code was in May 2008. This does not bode well.

Just because the last revision was a while ago or even longer does not
mean the project is dead.  It may mean that the author sees no need to
revise.

For example, there's been no public update to my current project since
the summer of 2007; the type of work going on does not quickly show up
in code.

                                    -- Bill

Re: w3 and css

[Harald Hanche-Olsen]

[William F Hammond <hammond@mapson.albany.edu>]

>> the git repository and ran git log, which tells me the latest revision
>> to the code was in May 2008. This does not bode well.
>
> Just because the last revision was a while ago or even longer does not
> mean the project is dead.  It may mean that the author sees no need to
> revise.

Absolutely. Which is why I said my conclusions were tentative. But I
also recall w3 being in an unusable condition last time I checked, which
admittedly was before the latest round of edits.

> For example, there's been no public update to my current project since
> the summer of 2007; the type of work going on does not quickly show up
> in code.

I believe the source code of TeX has been stable for much longer than
that. But it's much harder to make a stable web browser because it has
to track a moving target.

-- 
* Harald Hanche-Olsen     <URL:http://www.math.ntnu.no/~hanche/>
- It is undesirable to believe a proposition
  when there is no ground whatsoever for supposing it is true.
  -- Bertrand Russell

Re: w3 and css

[Peter Dyballa]

Am 19.02.2011 um 21:08 schrieb Harald Hanche-Olsen:

> I believe the source code of TeX has been stable for much longer than
> that.

Yes, that's true, but the CHange files do live!

--
Greetings

   Pete

To most people solutions mean finding the answers. But to chemists  
solutions
are things that are still all mixed up.

w3 and css

[Andrea Crotti]

I think I never actually saw w3 working on my machine, so I finally wanted to get it working.

I downloaded from the git repository here
http://www.gnu.org/software/w3/

configured an compiled.
But when I try to run it I get this backtrace:

So it finds the default css (which I didn't touch) and doesn't like the syntax of it.
Anyone else has the same problem? Am I missing something?

  call-interactively(w3 t nil)
  execute-extended-command(nil)
  call-interactively(execute-extended-command nil nil)
  recursive-edit()
  byte-code("\306\x10	@\307=\203!
  debug(error (wrong-type-argument arrayp nil))
  font-size(nil)
  font-default-size-for-device(nil)
  font-spatial-to-canonical("+12pt")
  css-expand-length("+12pt" t)
  css-expand-value(height "+12pt")
  css-parse-args(238 257)
  css-parse("file:/Users/andrea/Emacs-configuration/w3/etc/default.css" nil nil)
  w3-find-default-stylesheets()
  w3-refresh-stylesheets()
  w3-do-setup()
  w3()
  call-interactively(w3)
  ido-hacks-execute-extended-command(nil)
  call-interactively(ido-hacks-execute-extended-command nil nil)