From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: kai.grossjohann@uni-duisburg.de (Kai =?iso-8859-1?q?Gro=DFjohann?=) Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: M-TAB already used by KDE Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 15:25:54 +0100 Organization: University of Dortmund, Germany Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+gnu-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Message-ID: <84k7i63x1p.fsf@lucy.cs.uni-dortmund.de> References: <3dfe3ea4.1245206@news.cis.dfn.de> <84d6o1ove6.fsf@lucy.cs.uni-dortmund.de> <1my96ndvtq.fsf@Tempo.Update.UU.SE> <84n0n3cbvn.fsf@lucy.cs.uni-dortmund.de> <1mr8cfq9uv.fsf@Tempo.Update.UU.SE> <84ptry4g6v.fsf@lucy.cs.uni-dortmund.de> <1m8yymqkx7.fsf@Tempo.Update.UU.SE> NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: main.gmane.org 1040309647 14253 80.91.224.249 (19 Dec 2002 14:54:07 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@main.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 14:54:07 +0000 (UTC) Return-path: Original-Received: from monty-python.gnu.org ([199.232.76.173]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18P23m-0003hZ-00 for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 15:54:02 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.10.13) id 18P1ot-0002bR-07 for gnu-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 09:38:39 -0500 Original-Path: shelby.stanford.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!news.tele.dk!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!lucy.is.informatik.uni-duisburg.DE!not-for-mail Original-Newsgroups: comp.emacs,gnu.emacs.help Original-Lines: 53 Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: lucy.is.informatik.uni-duisburg.de (134.91.35.216) Original-X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 1040307953 2437505 134.91.35.216 (16 [73968]) User-Agent: Gnus/5.090008 (Oort Gnus v0.08) Emacs/21.2.93 (i686-pc-linux-gnu) Cancel-Lock: sha1:hP/9v2XMRYONelg7Pt5jz5zlCyM= Original-Xref: shelby.stanford.edu comp.emacs:76550 gnu.emacs.help:108296 Original-To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b5 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: List-Unsubscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+gnu-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:4826 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.help:4826 Fredrik Staxeng writes: > kai.grossjohann@uni-duisburg.de (Kai Großjohann) writes: > >>> If the default of x-meta-keysym is '(meta alt), then I am happy. >> >>Now that you bring it up, it would be a good idea to allow lists >>instead of just symbols. But that isn't implemented yet. > > What problem was this intended to solve then? KDE really really wants to see Alt_L and Alt_R keysyms for meta-like functionality. So using (setq x-meta-keysym 'alt), I can use them for meta-like functionality in Emacs, too. > Key names are just labels. What matters is the mapping from key > position to behaviour. The Emacs command set is designed with > the expectation that there is a shift-like modifier key that > is given the name Meta. In reality, very few keyboards provide > a key labeled Meta, but they provide a convenient substitute. > It's labeled Alt on PC keyboards, and it is labeled <> on Sun > keyboards. Yes. > Sun users know that their Alt key is not the same as the PC Alt key, > but PC users generally do not know the details of Sun keyboards. > They are used to that Alt is synonymous with Meta. Introducing a > different concept with the same name into Emacs is confusing. > > On the other hand, Super and Hyper are unambigously distinct from > Meta/Alt. That is, instead of putting mappings on Alt, which > assumes a Sun keyboard, put them on Super. And what do people do who had Super bindings before? You are suggestion to remove modifiers. This is not a good idea. People with foot pedals will hate you! > Your solution strikes me as a bit overengineered. I don't see the > need for full generality here, especially since there are two > (or three) other general layers (xkb, xmodmap and Emacs keymaps). > The solution above is simpler to understand and use for the > common practical cases I can imagine. > > If you really want full generality, the most powerful solution > would be a x-key-translate-hook. Yes. Thanks for the suggestion. I'll have to think about that "overengineered" part. Hmmm... -- ~/.signature is: umop ap!sdn (Frank Nobis)