From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Recent commit modifying mark-whole-buffer (master/aeb613ea95b7970e66d663ec5cba54e9ec0528fa) Date: Fri, 29 Apr 2016 09:45:12 +0300 Message-ID: <83wpngx69z.fsf@gnu.org> References: <87lh3x4dkb.fsf@gnus.org> Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1461912365 8584 80.91.229.3 (29 Apr 2016 06:46:05 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 29 Apr 2016 06:46:05 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Stephan Mueller Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Apr 29 08:45:49 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1aw2BP-0007hb-UN for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 29 Apr 2016 08:45:48 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:52565 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aw2BP-0006bi-34 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 29 Apr 2016 02:45:47 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:36885) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aw2B4-0006Yc-KU for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 29 Apr 2016 02:45:27 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aw2B1-00064I-EW for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 29 Apr 2016 02:45:26 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:37590) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aw2B1-00064E-CX; Fri, 29 Apr 2016 02:45:23 -0400 Original-Received: from 84.94.185.246.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.246]:4176 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1aw2B0-0004Hj-LQ; Fri, 29 Apr 2016 02:45:23 -0400 In-reply-to: (message from Stephan Mueller on Thu, 28 Apr 2016 22:25:09 +0000) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:203410 Archived-At: > From: Stephan Mueller > Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2016 22:25:09 +0000 > > Kaushal Modi writes: > " Question: > " - Should we revert mark-whole-buffer to its definition before this commit and > " mark-whole-buffer and make the cursor intangible by default in minibuffer > " prompt? > > +1 for "make minibuffer prompt generally inaccessible" to be more like the rest of the world (at least the parts I interact with). If that allows restoring mark-whole-buffer to its traditional, obvious, trivial implementation, then +1 more. Emacs always allowed one to enter the prompt, if one wanted badly enough. One use case where this is handy is when you need to copy the prompt text to somewhere else; I'm sure there are others. AFAIR, we make the prompt a field so that simple commands like C-a don't enter it inadvertently; that measure was good enough for us for many years. Why isn't it good enough now? The initial message in bug #21874 provides no rationale for the request (which seems to be a feature request, not a bug that needs to be fixed). So I'm not sure why we want to make such significant changes in behavior due to that bug report. Do I understand correctly that the proposed change will disallow doing that, without some complicated operations that many users won't even know about? If so, I object. Working with minibuffer prompts is too hardwired into the muscle memory of veteran Emacs users for us to change that in radical ways at this point. If some newcomers get surprised by some of the aspects of that behavior, I say let them get used, it doesn't take too long to do that.