From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#21998: Run 'make change-history' on release branch Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2016 21:11:40 +0200 Message-ID: <83vb50wxhv.fsf@gnu.org> References: <56BE7E37.3090708@cs.ucla.edu> <4hd1rw1ubr.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1457205141 8295 80.91.229.3 (5 Mar 2016 19:12:21 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2016 19:12:21 +0000 (UTC) Cc: 21998@debbugs.gnu.org To: Glenn Morris , John Wiegley Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Mar 05 20:12:11 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1acHcY-0003Rm-6s for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 05 Mar 2016 20:12:10 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:47792 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1acHcX-00034L-Jx for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 05 Mar 2016 14:12:09 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:56603) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1acHcT-00031H-El for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 05 Mar 2016 14:12:06 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1acHcQ-0008Ss-9U for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 05 Mar 2016 14:12:05 -0500 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.43]:38669) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1acHcQ-0008Sg-6H for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 05 Mar 2016 14:12:02 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84) (envelope-from ) id 1acHcQ-0003sk-2p for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 05 Mar 2016 14:12:02 -0500 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2016 19:12:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 21998 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 21998-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B21998.145720511114905 (code B ref 21998); Sat, 05 Mar 2016 19:12:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 21998) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Mar 2016 19:11:51 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:35796 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84) (envelope-from ) id 1acHcF-0003sL-Jx for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 05 Mar 2016 14:11:51 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:37327) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84) (envelope-from ) id 1acHcE-0003s8-A1 for 21998@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 05 Mar 2016 14:11:50 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1acHc8-0007xZ-5m for 21998@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 05 Mar 2016 14:11:44 -0500 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:36375) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1acHc4-0007tr-En; Sat, 05 Mar 2016 14:11:40 -0500 Original-Received: from 84.94.185.246.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.246]:2039 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1acHc3-0007OV-Gs; Sat, 05 Mar 2016 14:11:39 -0500 In-reply-to: (message from Glenn Morris on Fri, 04 Mar 2016 11:46:49 -0500) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 208.118.235.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:114463 Archived-At: > From: Glenn Morris > Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2016 11:46:49 -0500 > > At this point, I give up, since it seems fairly clear that maintaining > an accurate ChangeLog just isn't of interest. Even the bare minimum > legally relevant mistakes (missing "tiny change") don't seem to be being > corrected. Probably just deleting it from the repo would be more honest. > This will simplify things, eg the "correct log entries" step for making > a release can be dropped, and the AUTHORS file can become less accurate. > A rough non-versioned ChangeLog can still be generated for tarballs, if > anyone cares. Or, a version of the above, stop keeping a versioned copy > on any branch but master. I think if we care at all about having ChangeLog in the releases, we should simply reinstate the file and maintain it in the repository. I think this one-year experiment clearly demonstrates that creating ChangeLog from VCS logs simply doesn't work well enough. Look how much energy we invested in making that happen, and we are still nowhere as close to the solution as we'd like to be. OTOH, if one has git-merge-changelog installed, the conflicts in merging ChangeLog are very rare, and their resolution is simple. Other projects, like GDB, still maintain ChangeLog files, and don't seem to have any problems. So I'd say let's go back to maintaining a ChangeLog (a single file in the top-level directory), if we want a ChangeLog in the releases. And if we don't do that, let's decide there will be no ChangeLog files in the release tarballs at all, and stop worrying about these issues. What we have been trying to do -- both eat the cake and have it -- simply doesn't work. John?