From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#61847: debug-early-backtrace only works some of the time. Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2023 14:16:11 +0200 Message-ID: <83v8jkfz04.fsf@gnu.org> References: Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="14451"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, 61847@debbugs.gnu.org To: Alan Mackenzie Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Mar 01 13:17:31 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1pXLOl-0003Yk-4C for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2023 13:17:31 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pXLOS-000243-6Y; Wed, 01 Mar 2023 07:17:12 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pXLOJ-0001yp-Cx for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2023 07:17:04 -0500 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pXLOI-0005tB-Ru for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2023 07:17:02 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1pXLOI-0005ks-An for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2023 07:17:02 -0500 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2023 12:17:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 61847 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs Original-Received: via spool by 61847-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B61847.167767296722040 (code B ref 61847); Wed, 01 Mar 2023 12:17:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 61847) by debbugs.gnu.org; 1 Mar 2023 12:16:07 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52913 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1pXLNP-0005jQ-AT for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2023 07:16:07 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:38254) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1pXLNN-0005ih-1o for 61847@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2023 07:16:05 -0500 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pXLNG-0005mu-Lv; Wed, 01 Mar 2023 07:15:59 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=WlvQxD8fDZPgk5GwchHOJJ4CoKQ+hyc3da2WCVifA7g=; b=RGUejH25sT8L 75pK2aUNlWkSbAMGubdbW0Uk89BkI9QZPORz+50RpsX0svPVfyNM47w/EpxeFPFfFYS4TyKrlkexB VO+NptJlrJa+kP6r2NQMF1faIs3oPrFEqVjNAmLZXPn0XzyAAN3Ff1mpEeK26KPLS6/NtuM019Kpm rO1UioIX+CityVCAwqGdpGQGpwgM7D8dvkuO3XlvhEcnQa9s9LDnSeT+65GfyAmoVyVdPNi/1sXmw IzYBVxcWSwrzluKoLOyL9n5QtdCfHs6vUKhHxDAzFuGVgZ2Y+P5ndG15cREs7dPlZSK6eRUr8RjLz Y6t+try1/9i9iy2pxHCGZQ==; Original-Received: from [87.69.77.57] (helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pXLNF-0004uV-N5; Wed, 01 Mar 2023 07:15:58 -0500 In-Reply-To: (message from Alan Mackenzie on Tue, 28 Feb 2023 19:52:33 +0000) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:257052 Archived-At: > Cc: 61847@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Tue, 28 Feb 2023 19:52:33 +0000 > From: Alan Mackenzie > > The lack of output for compiled functions with cl-prin1 condemns it. All > that appears is "#f(compiled-function)" together with an empty pair of > parentheses and a meaningless hex address. What use is any of that in > debugging a batch mode bug? And what use is the meaningless stream of raw bytes that prin1 produces? > prin1 by contrast prints the actual contents of the function - its byte > code string and its constant vector, among other things. And with some of the bytes interpreted by the terminal, it is _really_ useful. To say nothing of attempting to post it in a bug report, where it can ruin the entire email message. I think you should re-evaluate your preferences, and base them on real advantages and disadvantages, not on imaginary ones. If we want our backtraces to be more informative, not less, we should move farther away of "dumb" output functions that just spill the guts and towards more humanly-readable formatted description of the called functions. IOW, make cl-prin1 smarter and teach it doing _more_ and do it _better_, not less and worse. For example, how about a more detailed, but human-readable description of bytecode?