From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>
To: Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com>
Cc: 16617@debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: bug#16617: 24.3.50; REGRESSION: `C-q ?' pops up annoying *Char Help* buffer
Date: Thu, 03 Apr 2014 19:24:15 +0300 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <83txaa9ya8.fsf@gnu.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <891cf052-6085-4ad4-b03b-83379a85ff0f@default>
> Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2014 11:15:45 -0800 (PST)
> From: Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com>
>
> This is a regression. `C-q ?' pops up an annoying "*Char Help*" buffer.
This is indeed a regression, but the only real bug I see here is that
the "*Char Help*" buffer pops _down_ so quickly one can hardly notice
it, let alone read the text it wants to display.
> What is said here for `?' is also true for `<f1>'. It is not true for
> `C-h', however.
C-h is explicitly excluded from triggering this. I don't know why '?'
should also be excluded -- it's not like someone needs C-q to insert
'?' in most situations -- but in any case it's one of the help
characters, and many commands show help when user presses '?'. I
don't see why this command should not.
> The char inserted when using `C-q <f1>' is `^@'.
> `<f1>' is not a character, so it should not cause a character to be
> inserted.
I disagree. C-q causes the next keystroke act as self-inserting
character. What that inserts depends on the keyboard configuration
and on the platform. I don't know how you decided that F1 should not
cause any insertions; FWIW, Emacs inserts ^@ (i.e. null) on GNU/Linux
as well, at least on the system where I tried.
> 1. The text in this help buffer is not formatted (e.g. filled)
> correctly.
Not sure if that is on purpose, but I can see some logic to the way it
is shaped.
> 2. The doc string for `quoted-insert' does not even mention this bizarre
> `?' behavior.
'?' is a usual help character; we don't mention its effect in any
other commands, so why should this be different?
> Nor does this behavior seem to be documented elsewhere.
??? From the Emacs manual (node "Help"):
`C-h', <F1>, or `?' means "help" in various other contexts as well.
For instance, you can type them after a prefix key to view a list of
the keys that can follow the prefix key. (A few prefix keys don't
support `C-h' or `?' in this way, because they define other meanings
for it, but they all support <F1> for help.)
> It is not even listed in NEWS as a change (an incompatible change, no
> less).
This feature is very old, so I don't see why you'd want to find it in
NEWS. We don't usually announce regressions in NEWS.
> 3. This *Char Help* buffer should not be popped up at all - for ANY char
> that you type after `C-q'. This is a misfeature. `?' should just be
> inserted, with no noise. It should certainly not be interpreted as
> a plea for help.
Disagree, see above. C-q is just another command, and as such, it can
benefit from some user guidance, like other commands.
> 4. With `emacs -Q', you might not even notice the popped-up *Char Help*
> buffer, which means that it does not even do what the enhancer
> presumably intended. It just flashes for an instant - impossible to
> read it, and serving no purpose but to annoy and puzzle. This alone
> is a regression wrt previous Emacs releases.
Agreed. This should be fixed.
> 5. In other contexts it can be even more annoying: (a) The help really
> is shown. (b) It can remain shown, requiring the user to remove it.
> (c) That can even involve requiring the user to change buffers and
> delete a frame. (d) It can require that you hit `?' again, to insert
> the `?' char (after moving back to the right frame).
This isn't different from any other help, is it? If so, I see no
problem here, just the usual Emacs behavior.
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2014-04-03 16:24 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 24+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2014-02-01 19:15 bug#16617: 24.3.50; REGRESSION: `C-q ?' pops up annoying *Char Help* buffer Drew Adams
2014-04-02 17:11 ` Drew Adams
2014-04-03 11:04 ` Dmitry Gutov
2014-04-03 14:32 ` Drew Adams
2014-04-03 15:16 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-04-03 15:23 ` Dmitry Gutov
2014-04-03 13:34 ` Leo Liu
2014-04-03 15:14 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-04-03 15:39 ` Leo Liu
2014-04-03 15:51 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-06-19 15:43 ` Stefan Monnier
2014-06-20 0:16 ` Leo Liu
2014-04-03 16:24 ` Eli Zaretskii [this message]
2014-04-06 19:33 ` Stefan Monnier
2014-04-07 2:43 ` Eli Zaretskii
[not found] <<891cf052-6085-4ad4-b03b-83379a85ff0f@default>
[not found] ` <<7367bf77-7602-4a02-82ce-804c2f88bf25@default>
[not found] ` <<m3sipuv8og.fsf@gmail.com>
[not found] ` <<831txebg2x.fsf@gnu.org>
2014-04-03 18:38 ` Drew Adams
2014-04-03 19:24 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-04-03 19:32 ` Daniel Colascione
2014-04-04 7:44 ` Eli Zaretskii
[not found] <<f87a9a1b-9378-4755-bbac-c88209ed8297@default>
[not found] ` <<83ppky9pyn.fsf@gnu.org>
2014-04-03 20:58 ` Drew Adams
2014-04-04 8:02 ` Eli Zaretskii
[not found] ` <<533DB732.70704@dancol.org>
[not found] ` <<83k3b5a69r.fsf@gnu.org>
2014-04-04 16:25 ` Drew Adams
2014-04-04 19:43 ` Eli Zaretskii
[not found] <<f842dbc1-09a3-4601-9f98-e580906762c7@default>
[not found] ` <<83r45c98yb.fsf@gnu.org>
2014-04-04 20:20 ` Drew Adams
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