From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Repo cpnversion progress report Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2014 18:15:00 +0200 Message-ID: <83ppn85drv.fsf@gnu.org> References: <20140130195557.GA8405@thyrsus.com> <83iot16u66.fsf@gnu.org> <20140130214201.GA9204@thyrsus.com> <83ha8k7fp0.fsf@gnu.org> <20140131152518.GA12642@thyrsus.com> Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1391185098 15148 80.91.229.3 (31 Jan 2014 16:18:18 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2014 16:18:18 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: esr@thyrsus.com Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Jan 31 17:18:24 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1W9GnO-0008N7-VB for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 31 Jan 2014 17:18:23 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:56748 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1W9GnO-00027m-5K for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 31 Jan 2014 11:18:22 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:42828) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1W9GkJ-0006xN-Dp for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 31 Jan 2014 11:15:16 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1W9GkC-0002m7-1s for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 31 Jan 2014 11:15:11 -0500 Original-Received: from mtaout29.012.net.il ([80.179.55.185]:47278) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1W9GkB-0002gk-MB for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 31 Jan 2014 11:15:04 -0500 Original-Received: from conversion-daemon.mtaout29.012.net.il by mtaout29.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0N0900H00WL0O200@mtaout29.012.net.il> for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 31 Jan 2014 18:16:40 +0200 (IST) Original-Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([87.69.4.28]) by mtaout29.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0N0900CP9X7R6580@mtaout29.012.net.il>; Fri, 31 Jan 2014 18:16:40 +0200 (IST) In-reply-to: <20140131152518.GA12642@thyrsus.com> X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6.x X-Received-From: 80.179.55.185 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:169281 Archived-At: > Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2014 10:25:18 -0500 > From: "Eric S. Raymond" > Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org > > Eli Zaretskii : > > I'm sorry, but my motivation to help you at this point is nil, I'm > > sure you understand why. > > I'm sorry, but if you're not going to be helpful, then expect to be > ignored. I'm ignored already. You never accepted any argument of mine through that long and tiresome "discussion". You are always right and all those who disagree with you are always wrong. > The cost of withdrawing any cooperation is that you lose influence > over the result. I never had any influence over that, because you refuse to listen to any dissenting arguments, and prefer to stubbornly do what you decided was right ahead of any discussion. > You get to take what comes out the other end and like it. Emacs is not my project, and this conversion is not my funeral. You may wish to stop being obsessed by my sorry self, and start seriously thinking of the greater good -- the good of the project with which you are messing. Because it's the project that will "take what comes out the other end", not me. > I'm not saying this out of personal rancor. This conversion job is so > messy and labor-intensive that I simply cannot spare the energy to > listen to people I think are just going to carp about it. You didn't listen to begin with. Look, you asked for comments on your progress report, and I gave them to you. It's up to you to act on those comments or ignore them. The results will speak for themselves. > Because I at least like to think I'm a reasonable person, you can > rescue this situation at any time by displaying behavioral evidence of > helpfulness. Thank you for this arrogant lecture, but I won't hold my breath if I were you, as I don't hold mine regarding a similar change in your behavior. > That means doing something concrete that helps the work along. I have no intention to help where my help is not welcome. If you want my help, you will need to accept and respect my judgments on what and how should or shouldn't be done, and at least sometimes agree or compromise. If instead you want to use me as a workhorse that just does as he is told and shuts up, you will have to look elsewhere. And I suggest all the others in this project to seriously consider whether we want to trust this job (or any job) to a man who thinks, speaks, and acts like you do.