From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: burden of maintainance Date: Thu, 01 Oct 2015 22:09:29 +0300 Message-ID: <83lhbm8kye.fsf@gnu.org> References: <560CEA6A.9000907@online.de> <834miaa847.fsf@gnu.org> <560D7F77.8060507@online.de> Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1443727524 16706 80.91.229.3 (1 Oct 2015 19:25:24 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 1 Oct 2015 19:25:24 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Andreas =?utf-8?Q?R=C3=B6hler?= Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Oct 01 21:25:10 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1ZhjTW-0008T6-UH for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 01 Oct 2015 21:25:07 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:55658 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZhjTV-0001Id-W0 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 01 Oct 2015 15:25:06 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:46710) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZhjEd-00035i-UU for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 01 Oct 2015 15:09:44 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZhjEb-0001B8-3b for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 01 Oct 2015 15:09:43 -0400 Original-Received: from mtaout20.012.net.il ([80.179.55.166]:39054) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZhjEa-0001Ah-Rt for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 01 Oct 2015 15:09:41 -0400 Original-Received: from conversion-daemon.a-mtaout20.012.net.il by a-mtaout20.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0NVK004002BHP600@a-mtaout20.012.net.il> for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 01 Oct 2015 22:09:38 +0300 (IDT) Original-Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([84.94.185.246]) by a-mtaout20.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0NVK004NF2K2HG70@a-mtaout20.012.net.il>; Thu, 01 Oct 2015 22:09:38 +0300 (IDT) In-reply-to: <560D7F77.8060507@online.de> X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Solaris 10 X-Received-From: 80.179.55.166 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:190583 Archived-At: > Date: Thu, 01 Oct 2015 20:46:15 +0200 > From: Andreas R=C3=B6hler > CC: Eli Zaretskii >=20 > > Suggestions for how to improve our test suite without alienating > > potential contributors are welcome. >=20 > What about saying: no checkin before the tests passed? That is OK, but what to do if some tests fail for many moons before they are fixed? We cannot stop development because of that. > Coverage and quality of tests should be an integral part of develop= ing. That's the hard part. Our current coverage is quite low (my impression; it would be good to have some tool that can measure that). Worse, for interactive features (and there are a lot of them)= , we lack the infrastructure for writing automated tests. Also, I don'= t quite see who will write tests for large portions of the C code, give= n how few people are even prepared to work on that. The result is that getting closer to good coverage is a huge job. > WRT to maintainance there are also redundancy, complexity which mig= ht be=20 > worked on. Alas, there are wildly different views on what is and isn't complex. > Keeping an eye at the number of symbols - too many blow up the lang= uage,=20 > make in harder for beginners than needed. Which symbols did you have in mind?