From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Lisp files that load cl-lib in problematical ways Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2023 15:21:23 +0300 Message-ID: <83lebqki4c.fsf@gnu.org> References: <87bkcx6eci.fsf@dataswamp.org> <83ttqnm4ti.fsf@gnu.org> <83lebyu5yx.fsf@gnu.org> <83bkcpo2cm.fsf@gnu.org> Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="4783"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: acm@muc.de, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: rms@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Oct 25 14:22:23 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1qvctz-00010a-7d for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 25 Oct 2023 14:22:23 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qvct3-0003GH-01; Wed, 25 Oct 2023 08:21:25 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qvct1-0003G9-Au for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Oct 2023 08:21:23 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qvct0-0001jb-Jc; Wed, 25 Oct 2023 08:21:22 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=6Ltk4zgZpbH4PpjfN24skw7ZcGrluq0kudjDgz2asj0=; b=O3d7Lk2s9W0m t+m2M7NmBaqTHoaNatjR5bloVvmVa5DJc9bIJ+q2RFdRfy5viEpfGlAytWMIKOgpXLdWiG8awwjcP uE82Y9AZ7Ff9W7dDb0YXFcMKbfPF1ZS1Aom+xOpQoi8yKfWT2OxYB9X4eqDE6bqGh2YWWQ6rEW65O IIufijHk54lOk1qrkWOu5ll6VwTFpM7VsrXyO8CXI7JlxXUTOE6zJqPncB5s6xDKPsolHGby8+3Z4 eog65pprC8e4SIxLJEFTVyrGud5g0TYZmPFaIHYRLvJ2WorZrFCJG2sR95nUA6xDtGG6O774vKrfS i5DdNQJETiWHi/LnLBMbIA==; In-Reply-To: (message from Richard Stallman on Tue, 24 Oct 2023 22:46:53 -0400) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:311835 Archived-At: > From: Richard Stallman > Cc: acm@muc.de, emacs-devel@gnu.org > Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2023 22:46:53 -0400 > > > > Even calling M-: (backtrace) causes cl-lib to get loaded. > > > That's because we use cl-print to display the backtrace. That change > > was done intentionally and for good reasons. So that is not a > > "problem" that needs to be "fixed", from where I stand. > > Can this load cl-print.el instead of cl-lib.el? Would that do the job? No. If you look at cl-print.el, you will immediately see why: it uses cl-incf and cl-find-class. Once again: we do pay attention to this stuff, so the chance of finding some random example where cl-lib is loaded due to a bug are slim. And in any case, it is not necessary to discuss this here, one can just look in the code using "C-h f".