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From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>
To: Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com>
Cc: michael_heerdegen@web.de, larsi@gnus.org, 13841@debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: bug#13841: 24.3.50; Regression - unreadable `C-h k' help
Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2016 20:29:56 +0300	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <83inyzngx7.fsf@gnu.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <f6490f90-dac1-4e7f-bb98-34877820dcb6@default> (message from Drew Adams on Sat, 30 Apr 2016 09:20:38 -0800 (GMT-08:00))

> Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2016 09:20:38 -0800 (GMT-08:00)
> From: Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com>
> Cc: michael_heerdegen@web.de, larsi@gnus.org, 13841@debbugs.gnu.org
> 
> > If you don't mind the Lisp form, you shouldn't mind the byte-compiled
> > form, either.
> 
> Excuse me, but this is sheer nonsense.  I find it really
> hard to believe that you are saying such a thing, Eli.
> You who care so much about reasonably understandable
> messages and doc for users.

Lisp code is not documentation.  I find it really hard to believe you
are saying such a thing, after filing so many bug reports about
unclear and unusable documentation.

> Emacs users often (perhaps usually) read straightforward
> Lisp code.  They do not read byte-code (except for rare
> exceptions - perhaps).

They should read neither as documentation.

> Source code is intended to be read by humans.  Compiled
> code, not so much.

But neither is documentation.

> > And if you cannot read bytecode, you can disassemble
> > it, then it should be as crystal-clear to you as the Emacs 23 vintage
> > result.
> 
> Wunderbar.  That's what you want to offer users, as
> opposed to fixing this bug.

No, I'm saying that we should not show code as documentation.

> > A more general solution is not to have lambda functions hang on keys
> > and mouse clicks.
> 
> That's not a more general solution to aggressive/eager
> byte-compiling.

Yes, it is.  If no code is show as documentation, aggressive/eager
byte-compiling will hurt no one.





  reply	other threads:[~2016-04-30 17:29 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 17+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2013-02-28 17:01 bug#13841: 24.3.50; Regression - unreadable `C-h k' help Drew Adams
2014-02-10  7:31 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2016-04-28 22:37   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2016-04-29 16:22     ` Drew Adams
2016-04-30 11:46       ` Michael Heerdegen
2016-04-30 15:37         ` Drew Adams
2016-04-30 15:52           ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-05-01 13:50             ` Michael Heerdegen
2016-05-01 15:09               ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-05-01 15:13                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2016-05-01 15:43                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2019-10-09  3:28                     ` bug#20157: " Lars Ingebrigtsen
2019-10-09 10:57                       ` Michael Heerdegen
2019-10-09 18:57                         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
     [not found]       ` <<87inyze2tq.fsf@web.de>
     [not found]         ` <<4e02c2a0-6e68-4091-a64d-131bcfc2fc49@default>
     [not found]           ` <<83wpnfnlf1.fsf@gnu.org>
2016-04-30 17:20             ` Drew Adams
2016-04-30 17:29               ` Eli Zaretskii [this message]
     [not found]       ` <<<87inyze2tq.fsf@web.de>
     [not found]         ` <<<4e02c2a0-6e68-4091-a64d-131bcfc2fc49@default>
     [not found]           ` <<<83wpnfnlf1.fsf@gnu.org>
     [not found]             ` <<f6490f90-dac1-4e7f-bb98-34877820dcb6@default>
     [not found]               ` <<83inyzngx7.fsf@gnu.org>
2016-04-30 18:14                 ` Drew Adams

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