From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs bug #23794; sort-line behavior regressed from prior Emacs versions Date: Sat, 18 Jun 2016 21:15:58 +0300 Message-ID: <83inx69xcx.fsf@gnu.org> References: <83shwa9zmr.fsf@gnu.org> <83lh229ywc.fsf@gnu.org> Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1466273731 30973 80.91.229.3 (18 Jun 2016 18:15:31 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 18 Jun 2016 18:15:31 +0000 (UTC) Cc: rms@gnu.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: rswgnu@gmail.com Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Jun 18 20:15:25 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1bEKmD-0006B1-EU for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 18 Jun 2016 20:15:25 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:35952 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bEKmC-0004RG-KE for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 18 Jun 2016 14:15:24 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:57447) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bEKm3-0004Nq-6N for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 18 Jun 2016 14:15:16 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bEKly-0007RT-4m for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 18 Jun 2016 14:15:14 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:37432) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bEKly-0007Qy-1F; Sat, 18 Jun 2016 14:15:10 -0400 Original-Received: from 84.94.185.246.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.246]:1928 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1bEKln-00019o-Ik; Sat, 18 Jun 2016 14:15:01 -0400 In-reply-to: (message from Robert Weiner on Sat, 18 Jun 2016 13:50:23 -0400) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:204485 Archived-At: > From: Robert Weiner > Date: Sat, 18 Jun 2016 13:50:23 -0400 > Cc: emacs-devel , Richard Stallman > > I see that you consider this a regression. But the change you refer > to was in Emacs 22.1, released 9 years ago, so we've lived with this > long enough to consider your proposal a new feature. > > Well, we just fixed a 20-year-old documentation bug on markers from some prior discussion, but I see why > you might want to view it that way. If the behavior is a bug, no matter how long-standing, it should certainly be > given some standing above a regular new feature request. I don't think it's a bug, in the sense that the old behavior was intended. I think the old behavior was a side effect of the implementation, so when the implementation changed, the behavior changed with it. IOW, I don't think it was ever the design goal to have sorting disregard invisible text. > I also think > that your proposed change goes farther than just restoring that old > behavior, because outline and its derivatives are not the only modes > that use invisible text. > > Can you provide one example where this patch changes the behavior of line sorting in a negative way? Why do you need examples? Isn't it clear that ignoring invisible text will affect much more than just outline modes? It's clear to me.